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Event transcript
Yeah, nothing's big too. 00:00:30
That's a big sucker. He's not happy. 00:00:33
Good evening. My name is Nate Creevy. I'm the director of Floyd County Plant Commission. 00:01:07
We are here for a special meeting of the BZA. 00:01:12
Before we get started, I would like to make an administrative announcement. 00:01:16
That Mister Scott Whalen has resigned from the board. 00:01:21
Mr. Guy Heidkemper has requested to be recused from. 00:01:26
The agenda item? 00:01:32
SO is under consideration for tonight. 00:01:33
The county commissioners have appointed Mr. Adam Roberts. 00:01:36
As an alternate. 00:01:40
For him. 00:01:42
And Mr. Bill White is absent for tonight. 00:01:44
With that said, we can begin the meeting and I'll call Roll. 00:01:47
I can do it from here, Mr. Larry Bieblehauser. 00:01:51
Here, Mr. Victor Andrew here. 00:01:54
Mr. Adam Roberts here. 00:01:56
Mr. Scott Whelan has resigned. Mr. Bill White is absent. 00:01:58
Thank you. 00:02:03
Thank you, Nick. The next thing we will need to take care of as the. 00:02:04
Chair and Vice Chair are not here this evening. We will need a motion to appoint a chair to run the meeting this evening. 00:02:07
I'll make a motion. 00:02:14
To appoint Mr. Unruh chair to run the meeting this evening. 00:02:15
OK, we have a motion for Mr. Unruh to serve as chair this evening. Do we have a 2nd? I'll second that. 00:02:18
All in favor. 00:02:22
Aye, any opposed? 00:02:23
Mr. Chairman, All right, let's go. All right. 00:02:26
Alrighty, this is the special meeting in Floyd County Board of Zoning Appeals. 00:02:29
Held on March 26th at 5:00 PM. 00:02:34
We went through roll call. 00:02:37
Yep, I got it. Sorry. 00:02:40
We've been through. 00:02:43
No old business. 00:02:45
At this point I turn it over to. 00:02:47
Frank, he returned over to me to go over that. Christy. Christy wants to go through the rules and procedures, of course. So just 00:02:50
brief overview. We do have them on the board behind us, but for those of you that have not been at one of our meetings before. 00:02:57
We do have sort of a formal process to allow for everything to be heard by the board. 00:03:04
And to allow for there to be. 00:03:09
Civil civility in the room so that we can proceed through the process that we need to proceed through. So we would request that 00:03:13
everybody in the room. 00:03:16
Make sure to silence cell phones and keep your comments. 00:03:20
To a minimum or. 00:03:24
When you're at the microphone only. Otherwise, please step out in the hallway if you wish to communicate with someone else so that 00:03:26
the board can hear what's going on in the room. 00:03:30
With that said, we do go through a process of. 00:03:34
The Chairman President will read the docket item on the agenda. 00:03:38
The director and staff will go through their staff recommendations and their staff report. 00:03:42
As well as any notice compliance requirements that are necessary. 00:03:47
The petitioner applicant will then have 10 minutes to present the application request. 00:03:50
The board can choose to expand the time periods. 00:03:55
That are set out. 00:03:59
If they choose to do so for good cause. 00:04:00
The board members may ask questions of the applicant. That's their opportunity to ask the applicant any questions about what's 00:04:03
being presented. 00:04:06
Next will come public comments. Those public comments are directed to the board. 00:04:10
About concerns, whether you're in favor or in opposition for you to voice those opinions to the board, it's not for you to. 00:04:14
Direct your comments to other people in the audience or to. 00:04:21
Communicate with the other side for any reason it is to direct to the board and again those are 10 minute periods each 10 minutes 00:04:25
for those in favor. 00:04:29
10 minutes for those in opposition. 00:04:33
That is 10 minutes for the total. Again, the board may choose to expand that at some point during the meeting, but that is not 10 00:04:35
minutes per person that chooses to speak. It is 10 minutes for the entire. 00:04:40
Section of those in favorable and those in opposition. 00:04:45
After that, the petitioner has the applicant. Petitioner has an opportunity to come back up for rebuttal to address any comments 00:04:49
they feel are necessary from those in favor and those in opposition. Thereafter, the Board will discuss the case, ask any 00:04:55
questions that they may deem appropriate of the applicant or staff, and then ultimately A ballot will be called for and 00:05:00
potentially voted on this evening. 00:05:05
Any questions? 00:05:12
At this time, Frank, if you come forward. 00:05:14
Good afternoon. 00:05:28
Franklin, Malden County Planner. 00:05:31
I've got docket number FC 022608. 00:05:33
Petitioners Sporting Club at the farm located at 4939 Highway 111. 00:05:38
New Albany, IN. 00:05:42
The request is for a special exception to amend conditions from special exception request. 00:05:44
This is in the agricultural residential zoning district. 00:05:48
Applicant is requesting amendments to existing conditions of approval to adjust shooting boundaries, adjust headcount limitation. 00:05:52
Alter shooting hours and alter-led reclamation operations. 00:05:58
As a. 00:06:02
History of the previous. 00:06:04
Dockets, June 10th, 2019. Docket FC 4/19/13. 00:06:05
Special exception request for a wildlife preserve in Sportsman Club. 00:06:10
March 10th, 2020 Docket. 00:06:14
FC 41913 Modification of original docket to allow events with alcohol. 00:06:16
September 13th I've got a typo in there for 15th. September 13th, 2021 Docket FC 82121 Modifications of original docket to adjust 00:06:21
hours of operation. 00:06:26
For special events, shooting courses. 00:06:31
Boundaries and to allow overnight camping. 00:06:33
And then November 25th, 2025, Docket FC-92527 Petition for revocation, which was denied but with required actions. 00:06:36
So the base conditions for this. 00:06:45
Uh, with approval for Docket FC 4/19/13. 00:06:48
One received the construction and a floodway permit from the Indiana Department of Natural Resources, if required. 00:06:51
Two shooting ranges must follow the most recent NRA Range Sourcebook guidelines, including noise dampening measures with a maximum 00:06:56
decibel reading of 75 decibels at property line or public roadways. 00:07:01
Three, the range must follow the EPA's Best Management Practices for Leaded Outdoor Shooting ranges and the Environmental 00:07:06
Stewardship Plan included in the application. 00:07:10
Forward developments stormwater prevention plan with Floyd County stormwater department with emphasis on. 00:07:14
Lead contamination. 00:07:20
Five hours of operation for use of the range. 00:07:22
So a summer. 00:07:25
Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 AM to 7:00 PM. Sunday, noon to 7:00 PM Be Winter Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 AM to 5:00 PM. 00:07:27
Sunday, noon to 5:00 PM. 00:07:31
With a note that summer. 00:07:35
Begins with daylight savings times changes. 00:07:37
Amended March 10th. 00:07:39
By Docket FC 4/19/13 to add hours of events are Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 AM to 11:30 PM. 00:07:42
This is amended 9/14/2021 by Docket. 00:07:49
FC 8/21/21 to add that special shooting tournaments events. 00:07:52
8:00 AM to sunset and E. 00:07:56
Gun shooting events that require an early start time are limited to five events per year and not more than one per month. 00:07:59
Each special event requires. 00:08:04
The issuance of a temporary use permit through the Floyd County Building and Development Office. 00:08:06
With each temporary use. 00:08:11
Permit The applicant is required to place signage announcing each event no less than 30 days prior and mailing a notice. 00:08:13
One property owner deep 2 property owners informing them of the dates of the event once the event is finalized and not less than 00:08:18
30 days prior to the event. 00:08:21
6 Development plan with requirements per Section 9.05 The Floyd County Zoning Ordinance submitted with review and approval by 00:08:27
staff. 00:08:31
7 The Floyd County Board of Zoning Appeals with the assistance of staff. 00:08:34
Shall review for compliance with all requirements one year from data. 00:08:37
Full operation 8. 00:08:40
No shooting within 300 yards of any property line or public roadway. 00:08:42
This was amended 9/15/2021 by Docket. 00:08:45
FC 8/21/21 to add amended to exhibit boundaries. Shooting station located at an elevation. 00:08:49
10 feet below berm. The boundary expansion is allowed with the following requirement. 00:08:54
All stations are pointed inward toward the property interior and the outer shooting stations to have posted. 00:08:59
Rules prohibiting loading of weapons until the participant is securely in the shooting station prior to firing. 00:09:04
9 No rifles or pistols, only birdshot. 00:09:09
10 amended with docket FC 4/19/13 to remove the condition that. 00:09:12
The remainder of the farm outside the limits of the 24 station shooting course shown on the. 00:09:17
Plan is restricted to farm use only. 00:09:21
11 Applicant must obtain requirement permits from the Floyd County Health Department. 00:09:23
12 At minimum, every two years in the dry season, shooting associated materials and lead shall be reclaimed from shotfall area. 00:09:27
13 Contact LG and E regarding shooting in the area toward power lines on property. 14 Amended with Docket 4 or FC-41913 to alter. 00:09:34
The line. 00:09:43
No alcoholic beverages will be permitted on the site is removed. 00:09:44
Alcoholic beverages. 00:09:47
Or and instead it's alcoholic beverages will not be permitted within 200 yards of range Area alcohol to be catered by a licensed 00:09:48
vendor only no other alcoholic. 00:09:52
Beverages permitted at any other time. 00:09:57
Once alcohol is served, the range and hunting areas will be closed. 15 The applicant will work to buffer sound for Mr. Riley's 00:09:59
property. 00:10:02
This was amended 9/14/2021 by Docket FC 8/21/21 to add. 00:10:05
Increase the buffer for the Riley property with a denser planting minimum of 25 and taller trees minimum of 10 feet. 00:10:09
Approved by staff. 00:10:15
Consider the location of the shooting station when placing trees. 00:10:16
16 Amended by Docket FC 4/19/13 to alter. 00:10:20
There's a strikeout through the line upland. Game hunting is restricted to unforced areas and other restrictions on shooting of 00:10:24
guns. 00:10:27
And is replaced with maximum people at events 500 per day if more than 300. 00:10:31
Must have. 00:10:35
Traffic control. 00:10:36
This was amended with Docket FC 8/21/21 to add. 00:10:38
Camping tinter RV is allowed for the same dates as the temporary use permits the applicant. 00:10:41
Is required to contact the health department prior to issuance to guide. 00:10:45
Or to gain guidance and any required. 00:10:48
Permitting for overnight stays camping is permitted in any area as long as it's a safe location. Camping location to be designated 00:10:51
at the time of the temporary use permit application. 00:10:55
And then for the petition of revocation. 00:11:01
Required actions were. 00:11:04
Were made for FC-925271 owner meeting with two board members and staff. This has been met 2 Enforcement of staff's recommendations 00:11:06
as stipulated in the staff report, the aforementioned recommendation state. 00:11:12
For the restricted boundary areas restriction, a survey should be conducted and farm staff shall post markings signs dedicated 00:11:19
along the restricted area. 00:11:23
Every 50 feet or so I do not have. 00:11:27
Proof that this has been met yet? 00:11:29
Next for maximum attendees restrictions. 00:11:31
Moderate event capacity by both spectators and participants via sign in sheet or other event attendance tracking. 00:11:34
For the traffic restriction, ensure traffic control. 00:11:41
Contractors are operating for duration of events. 00:11:43
And then Item 3, no archery events until corrections are made for a Marshall shall be present at all archery events. Five payment 00:11:46
of fines in the amount of $3000 which has been paid. 00:11:51
So the applicant requests the following alterations request #1 Alteration of approved shooting boundary to allow archery and 00:11:57
upland hunts close to the property line. 00:12:01
This would amend a couple of those conditions. So #8 proposed amendment. 00:12:05
By Docket FC2268. 00:12:09
To remove the no shooting with. 00:12:12
Been 300 yards of any property line or public roadway and instead replace that with the. 00:12:14
No shooting within 30 feet of any property line or public roadway. Accepting a continued 300 yard buffer from the Riley residence. 00:12:18
Where archery would be allowed within 50 yards of said Riley property line per the attached boundary plan. 00:12:24
This would still include that prior amendment. 00:12:30
With that was amended back with 9/15/2021. 00:12:33
Item 15. The applicant will work to buffer sound from Mr. Riley's property, the proposed amendment. 00:12:38
With Docket FC2268. 00:12:43
Is to add enhanced visual screening. 00:12:46
And supplement sound diffusion by purchasing and planting additional fast growing trees to be installed, particularly along the. 00:12:49
Riley property line. 00:12:54
As my own personal note, item 2 shooting ranges must follow the. 00:12:56
Most recent NRA range source guidelines. 00:13:01
Including that 5075 decibels at property line or public roadways. 00:13:04
This is for shooting ranges, not for the upland hunting activities. 00:13:08
Request #2 Alteration of the fixed headcount limitation and replace it with the traffic control standard. 00:13:13
This amends. 00:13:18
Condition 16. Proposed amendment by Docket FC2268. 00:13:19
Events exceeding 500 attendees will require certified traffic control for the duration of the event and. 00:13:24
Striking out the maximum people at events 500 per day if more than 300 must have traffic control. 00:13:29
Request #3 Alteration of the current shooting and event hours for DNR hunting hours. 00:13:35
So the proposed amendment. 00:13:40
To condition #5 would change the hours of operation. 00:13:43
For the range to remove the Tuesday through Saturday and Sunday. 00:13:47
Specifics to match DNR hunting hours. 00:13:51
And then B allow shooting until half hour prior to dusk from March until end of August. 00:13:54
And then would strike out the. 00:13:59
Daylight savings times and then we strike out the hours of events Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 to 11:30. 00:14:01
An additional. 00:14:06
A proposed amendment there would be. 00:14:08
Item F Glow Clay shooting events permitted on Friday afternoons evenings from November through February. Limited to 4 per month. 00:14:11
With glow-clay events ending at 10. 00:14:17
Shoot locations to be located at existing 5 stand locations opposite of the Riley property. 00:14:19
And request #4 alteration of the current lead reclamation operations. 00:14:24
This would amend condition #3 the rain. 00:14:28
Which would add increased pH testing from 2 times per year to four times per year. 00:14:32
Maintain that. 00:14:37
Vegetative stabilization in shopfall areas and maintain overlapping shopfall containment zones. 00:14:38
We would also amend. 00:14:43
Condition #12 proposed amendment. 00:14:44
Strikeout at minimum every two years in the dry season. Shooting associated. 00:14:47
Materials and lead shall be reclaimed from shopfall areas. 00:14:51
And then replace that with lead reclamation to occur every ten years or based on a professional evaluation, the pH testing 00:14:54
results. 00:14:57
Just a moment. 00:15:01
Thank you. 00:15:09
So for staff comments, the special exception will not be injurious to the public health, safety, morals and general welfare of the 00:15:11
community. 00:15:14
Request number one to alter the boundary for hunting and archery are found to not be injurious in areas where the rugged. 00:15:17
Nature of the surrounding landscape and wooded buffers offer protection for neighboring properties and where archery and hunting 00:15:22
activities are not aimed towards these neighboring properties. 00:15:26
Additionally, hunting activities are found to be less frequent and in less intensity than. 00:15:29
Then the shooting stations. 00:15:33
Which are still limited in their location so long as hunters are clearly aware of the property lines. 00:15:35
Request #2 to amend traffic standards. 00:15:40
May want additional clarification from in dot which. 00:15:42
I received a an e-mail correspondence from. 00:15:46
In dot yesterday afternoon, which I'll. 00:15:49
This is stating that they did not have issues. 00:15:59
With. 00:16:02
Changes to the. 00:16:03
Number of people on the on the site. 00:16:06
Request #3 for alterations to hours are to be limited to daytime hours or DNR hunting standards. 00:16:08
Request #4 for an alteration of the lead. Mitigation efforts are to be accompanied by a better soil monitoring system and 00:16:14
alternative triggers. 00:16:17
For lead reclamation. 00:16:21
2 The use and value of the area adjacent to the property is. 00:16:22
Subject to the special exception, will not be affected in a substantially adverse manner. 00:16:25
The site currently allows for agricultural uses by rights such as logging operations, which have more of a noise impact than 00:16:30
changes proposed. 00:16:33
Most of the site is buffered by substantial wooded areas, natural terrain and the end of dispersion of the proposed activities. 00:16:36
Limits to disruption are provided through time restrictions, provisions of buffers to open. 00:16:41
Residential areas, directions in which shots are allowed to be fired and landscaping provisions. 00:16:47
Three, the need for the special exception does arise from some condition peculiar to the property involved. 00:16:52
The site encompasses over 500 acres with highly irregular topography, extensive wooded buffers. 00:16:57
Elevation changes and multiple natural barriers. 00:17:03
That are unique to the site. 00:17:05
Much of the topography is not buildable due to flooding or elevation, limiting the typical uses of the parcel. 00:17:07
For the strict application of the terms of the Floyd County zoning ordinance will result in an unnecessary hardship in the use of 00:17:12
the property. 00:17:15
This use is not specified in the zoning ordinance requiring a special exception. 00:17:19
The applicant argues. 00:17:23
That the amendments to the original condition. 00:17:24
Are based on a development, Sorry. 00:17:27
Based on a developed experience in managing of this type of use and that many of the original conditions did not reflect the 00:17:29
actual safety conditions, terrain or operational capacities of the site. 00:17:34
And five, the approval of the special exception will not contradict the goals and objectives of the Floyd County Comprehensive 00:17:39
Plan. The 2017 Vision Floyd County Comprehensive Plan details community preferences on page 23. 00:17:45
Which lists a preference for more recreational and park activities at 74% and more entertainment and cultural activities or 00:17:51
cultural events at 65%. 00:17:55
Further, a sporting club fits with the key community vision themes under play and visit, providing recreation for the local 00:17:59
community and a regional tourism desk. 00:18:02
Uh, destination. 00:18:06
So for staff recommendations. 00:18:11
With request #1 Alteration of approved shooting boundary to allow archery and upland hunts closer to the property line. 00:18:13
Staff finds that if this were non commercial, the proposed activities of archery and hunting would be permitted up to the property 00:18:19
line. Staff finds that the 300 yard buffer to be too limiting, but finds a 10 yard buffer is not adequate. 00:18:24
So that finds that the hunting shots fired do not occur at the same frequency as rain shots and thus should not have the same 00:18:30
level of disturbance. However, the intensity of activities is increased due to the commercial nature of this property. 00:18:35
Including trails, camping and parking for events. Justifying at least the partial use of commercial buffers along the property 00:18:40
line of a lower intensity use to protect residents. 00:18:44
Further, Section 5.20 of the Floyd County ordinance. 00:18:48
Requires no parking within a commercial buffer yard. 00:18:51
The natural buffers and rugged terrain that protect most of the neighbors is not president. 00:18:54
Sorry, is not present. 00:18:58
For portions of the Riley property and so a greater buffer is warranted for firearms. 00:19:02
Neighboring residents have expressed safety concerns over proximity of shots and have reported multiple arrows landing within 00:19:06
their property along the previous archery events and hunters facing towards their property. 00:19:11
The Archery Range Guide for Community Parks, written by Archery Trade Association, by the Archery Trade Association and utilized 00:19:16
by Indiana Department of Natural Resources. 00:19:19
Recommends ordinances to prevent hunting within 150 feet or 50 yards of residential property lines and public right of ways, and 00:19:23
further recommends that any shots fired within 150 yards should be faced towards the interior of the property. 00:19:29
The Archery Range Guide further provides best practices for target safety, such as a buffer beyond the target or provision of a. 00:19:35
Fence or berm? 00:19:41
And recommends firing those at an angle no greater than parallel to the ground and encourages placing targets below shooting 00:19:42
positions. Additionally, as unguided hunts are offered and hunters may be unfamiliar with the property, borders and safety 00:19:47
concerns are expressed over archery stations in proximity to neighbors. 00:19:51
The following conditions are recommended. 00:19:56
Property boundaries are to be marked to the specification of IC 354322. 00:19:59
Also known as the purple paint law as an example, with purple painted trees at 3 to 5 feet high and not more than 100 feet from 00:20:04
the nearest other marked tree. 00:20:08
The property line is to be marked by the beginning of the shooting. Preserve licensed game bird hunting period. 00:20:13
Which is by September 1st, 2026. 00:20:18
No hunting or archery shotfall to occur within 50 yards of any property line or public roadway. Accepting a continued 300 yard 00:20:21
buffer for the Riley residence. 00:20:24
Where hunting shotfall is not permitted, but where archery would still be allowed. 00:20:28
For the attached boundary plan. 00:20:32
Shot fall area here being defined as the area to the side or behind a target where shots may be reasonably expected to land. 00:20:33
But not to restrict shots that may fall short of the. 00:20:40
Of a target. 00:20:42
As a note, the former change to buffer area to remain as amended on 9/15/21. 00:20:44
By Docket FC, 8/21/21. 00:20:49
No trails, firing of weapons, or commercial activity such as, but not limited to parking, RV campgrounds or porta pots within 5 00:20:52
yards of property line. 00:20:56
This buffer shall have at least one deciduous canopy tree for only 15 feet of contiguous boundary and or a row of Evergreen trees 00:21:01
and a height of. 00:21:04
At a height of 6 feet, placed every 12 feet when adjacent to neighboring parcels. 00:21:07
Archery stations should follow the recommendations of the most recent Archery Trade Associations Archery Range Guide for community 00:21:12
parks as utilized by Indiana DNR. 00:21:16
Rules for safety, which are listed on page 11 of this edition, must be posted at Shooting. 00:21:20
Shooting stations. 00:21:25
And as clarity for that. 00:21:26
This can be like paper staple to a post. 00:21:28
Request #2. 00:21:31
Alteration of the fixed headcount limitation and replace it with a traffic control standard. Staff supports lifting the 500 guests 00:21:32
maximum requirement, but the following condition is recommended. 00:21:37
For events exceeding 500 attendees. 00:21:42
Will require certified traffic control for the duration of the event. 00:21:45
Events with 500 or fewer attendees will implement traffic control as required by INDOT, but we have a. 00:21:50
An e-mail to update. 00:21:55
From that. 00:21:56
Request #3 Alteration of the current shooting at event hours to DNR hunting hours. 00:21:58
Clarification is needed as DNR does not have one set of hunting times for all game, while pheasant and chukar fall under the small 00:22:03
game hunting hours which are not restricted by DNR. 00:22:07
Staff does not recommend allowing hunting activities after nightfall. 00:22:12
So sunset in Floyd County is roughly 5:30 PM in early December to 9:00 PM in late July. 00:22:15
The level of disturbance caused by hunting and archery is different than that of the shooting stations. Therefore, staff 00:22:20
recommends the following conditions. 00:22:23
Operating hours for hunting and archery activities is to follow migratory birds and waterfowl hunting hours of half hour before 00:22:27
sunrise to sunset. 00:22:30
Operating hours for the shooting stations is Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 AM to half hour before sunset. 00:22:35
Sunday noon to half hour before sunset. 00:22:39
Request #4 Alteration of the current lead reclamation operations. 00:22:42
Hey, Frank, could you stop me just a second? Give me a rest. 00:22:46
We failed to ask the applicant. 00:22:50
We do not have a full board. 00:22:53
So it's it's at your. 00:22:55
Option to either. 00:22:59
Table this or whatever without a full board so. 00:23:01
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. If you can come up, that'd be great. 00:23:04
We just want to get confirmation if you're OK with us proceeding without a full board. 00:23:07
I didn't want you to keep reading if they did. 00:23:12
Mark Phillips and and Joe Craig, we've talked about it since we talked to Christy about it. 00:23:16
Talk to Nick about it. 00:23:20
And we have no objection understanding that. 00:23:21
Whatever decision you make has to be unanimous, whatever that is. 00:23:24
And so let me just confirm a JoJo. 00:23:27
Yes, representing accurately your position. 00:23:30
Yes, understanding whatever the determination is, you can't come back later and say, oh, no, didn't agree. Yeah. 00:23:33
We're good. Thank you. Go ahead, Frank. I'm sorry. 00:23:37
I don't normally. 00:23:41
Chair this board. So I forgot to thanks for the thanks for the break. You need a break anyway. 00:23:42
So request #4 alteration of the current lead reclamation operations. 00:23:50
The EPA's best management practices for lead at Outdoor shooting ranges indicates in Chapter 3, page 3-16, that for shotgun ranges 00:23:54
there is a wide range in reclamation standards. 00:23:59
One source indicates reclamation should occur when a range has thrown 250,000 to 1,000,000 targets. 00:24:04
While another source indicates reclamation should occur if at least 2 lbs of lead per square foot have accumulated on the range. 00:24:09
Averaging about 1 oz. 00:24:14
Of lead per shot and considering approximately 50 acres in the shooting range. Shotfull area for the farm. 00:24:16
This would be roughly 69,696,000 shots fired. 00:24:22
In the same section, the guide states that the NRA recommends a frequency of one to five years for lead cleanup, even on ranges 00:24:26
with minimal use. This is quoted from Metallic Bullets, Lead Deposits on outdoor and indoor firing ranges from 1991. 00:24:31
In the report prepared by Doctor Richard Petticoard submitted to staff in March of 2024, it is indicated that lead reclamation at. 00:24:37
Small to moderate size clay target. 00:24:45
Ranges as occurring at intervals of perhaps five to seven years. 00:24:47
But much more commonly 8 to 10 year or longer intervals, with many in the mid to upper teens of years between reclamation 00:24:50
activities. 00:24:53
As this is in the AE flood way, care must also be given to prevent excess erosion caused due to the vegetation removal necessary 00:24:57
for shot reclamation. 00:25:00
The IDEM technical Guidance document for leaded outdoor small arms firing ranges on page 2 indicates that drinking water is seldom 00:25:06
affected by firing ranges because of the low solubility and restricted migration of metallic lead. 00:25:11
To further address concerns of lead in groundwater, though. 00:25:17
Soil acidity should be kept in the ideal range of 6.5 to 8.5 on the pH scale as listed in the Best management practices. 00:25:19
Chapter 2, page 21 and 2. 00:25:26
While the ITRC guide. 00:25:29
For environmental management. 00:25:30
Operating Outdoor Small Arms Firing ranges, pages 8 and 9 indicates rain and the acidity of the rain as potential causes for lead 00:25:32
mobility. 00:25:36
It also indicates that organic materials and clay absorb lead and remove it from the water. 00:25:40
The soil for this property, according to the soils layer and beacon derived from the soil survey geographic database, shows the 00:25:44
shotfall areas, a mix of silt looms. 00:25:48
Software rec. 00:25:52
Soft bedrock substratum. 00:25:53
And primarily silty clay loam as indicated by. 00:25:55
Womack whoa, sorry WM AK in that set layer. 00:25:58
Given the prevalence of clay on the site and that the area is vegetated. 00:26:03
That soil is being tested for acidity and that item indicates drinking water is seldom affected. 00:26:06
There are multiple protections to keep lead from migrating off site. 00:26:11
Staff finds that clarification is needed for when a professional evaluation should be triggered though. 00:26:14
And to forbid clustering of test results, the following conditions are recommended. 00:26:18
The four required pH testings for soil sampling must occur to the specifications listed in Appendix C of the Environmental 00:26:24
Stewardship Plan at least 45 days apart and the tests done by an independent third party. 00:26:29
The testing results should be provided as an annual report by March 1st of each year. 00:26:35
To the Floyd County Planner, with copies provided to the Floyd County Stormwater Director. 00:26:39
And to the local law. 00:26:43
Sorry, and to the local water provider as concerned parties. 00:26:44
This report should also include an approximate number of rounds fired for that year. 00:26:48
A requirement for lead reclamation is to be triggered by the following events. 00:26:52
10 years from the last row. 00:26:56
From the last lead reclamation. 00:26:57
Every 10 million shots. 00:26:59
Or if the tested pH level. 00:27:01
Falls outside of the 6.5 to 8.5 ideal range for three consecutive soil testings. 00:27:03
A required lead reclamation can be delayed if a staff approved credentialed expert submits a professional evaluation indicating 00:27:08
when the next lead reclamation should occur. 00:27:12
Applicant will send an updated plan to planning staff within 90 days of any amendment to conditions which impact the Environmental 00:27:17
Stewardship Plan, including this request. 00:27:21
Thank you. 00:27:26
Does anybody have any questions for Frank? 00:27:28
Larry, thank you, Frank. 00:27:32
OK, at this time would the applicant like to come forward and present their case? 00:27:36
Yeah, Joe Cray, 7209 Maplin Place Prospect, KY. 00:27:51
Yeah, Mark Phillips. 00:27:56
31 W Main St. Boonville, IN. 00:27:59
We addressed the board. 00:28:03
Let me, let me. I'm sorry. We were just talking about the possibility of expansion and dealing with that upfront. Christie's 00:28:04
recommended that we double the time that we normally do go to 20 minutes. 00:28:09
In fact, we don't intend to use the full 10 minutes, OK. So, so anyway, I'm sure that you guys would want the 20 minutes. 00:28:15
Absolutely. OK, so let's record show that. 00:28:20
That. 00:28:25
He refused 20, they accept 20 on the on the front end. But when we have the right to close, we may ask for a little bit of leeway 00:28:26
if that's necessary. OK, so so let me explain why why we don't think we need the 10 minutes. 00:28:32
We have presented to you. 00:28:39
An application. 00:28:42
To modify the conditions. 00:28:43
That in most part. 00:28:46
Mr. Walden agrees to There are just a couple things. 00:28:48
That I want to clarify. 00:28:51
One of which is. 00:28:53
And the pages aren't numbered, so I can't tell you what the number of pages, but one of the things and and I'm going to start from 00:28:56
from the end moving forward. 00:28:59
One of the things that Mister Walden identified and I'm reading from. 00:29:02
The 76 page. 00:29:07
Draft of the report we got this week. 00:29:10
And it is a. 00:29:12
It is a. 00:29:14
It is from this. 00:29:15
This is the. 00:29:17
What it looks like. 00:29:18
If that helps you. 00:29:19
But it's a document after maps and after applications and after some other things. 00:29:20
And it provides for. 00:29:26
And it's in reference to some extent, what, what Mr. when Mr. Petticord presented. But there's something if you'll go to the 00:29:28
second page. 00:29:31
Or I'm sorry, third page. 00:29:36
And I'm reading from paragraph 4. 00:29:37
This is a survey that was done. 00:29:39
Each of the three company representatives, and these were people in different areas that run shooting. 00:29:42
Facilities and and clay ranges like like the farm. 00:29:47
Each of the three company representatives summarized their knowledge of shot reclamation at smaller, moderate sized clay target 00:29:50
ranges. 00:29:53
As occurring at intervals of perhaps five to seven years, but much more commonly 8 to 10 years. 00:29:57
Or longer and that would meet Mr. Walters recommendation. 00:30:01
But they go further to say. 00:30:04
With many in the mid upper teens of years between reclamation activities. 00:30:05
Paragraph 6. Management of a sporting club at the farm contacted operators of three ranges in the state of Indiana, one in 00:30:10
northern part of the state. 00:30:13
Does not reclaim shot at all. 00:30:17
Central IN range is roughly the size of the sporting club at the farm has been in operation for 10 to 15 years. 00:30:18
And has never reclaimed shot. 00:30:23
In the third range in southern Indiana, reclaimed shot from Stratfields at approximately 20 year intervals but does not reclaim. 00:30:25
Shot from a sporting clays course and so. 00:30:30
The the 10 years probably is reasonable. 00:30:34
We have a gentleman, if you. 00:30:36
One last question to you met before. 00:30:38
And I will tell you. 00:30:41
That in the packet of information. 00:30:42
Farther back than that. 00:30:45
There is a section. 00:30:46
Two page section of questions submitted to Argent. 00:30:48
Argent's here. 00:30:51
And having read that, he recommends that the final question. 00:30:52
Is if this were your own range, when would you plan the next reclamation? And he said 20 years. 00:30:57
So, and it's largely because of the concentration in the small area in which that shot falls and. 00:31:01
If you have questions, he's a better. 00:31:07
Source to answer that question than I am. 00:31:09
Secondly. 00:31:11
I want to remind the board and and. 00:31:12
You did a nice job of recapping what's occurred. 00:31:16
For those of us that were not here when this started. 00:31:18
But in 2020, after the initial restrictions were in place. 00:31:21
The Farm. 00:31:25
Which did not include Joe's involvement at that time. 00:31:26
Planet 40. 00:31:31
Spruce trees. 00:31:32
In 2023, they planted 40 more. 00:31:34
Spruce trees, and they did it in an area that was directed by the board. 00:31:36
They spent around $10,000. 00:31:40
Or more to do that. 00:31:42
And those were placed at the direction of the board where it was determined that those would be necessary for sound. 00:31:44
Purposes. 00:31:49
Had nothing to do with vision. 00:31:50
And so they complied with that request. They have complied with the request that you imposed regarding marking the property. 00:31:52
The purple paint is intended to keep trespassers off. 00:32:00
For those of us that own private property and have the fear of people trespassing, that's what we're. 00:32:03
Required to do to give them notice and then if they don't comply we can. 00:32:07
We can report them and they could possibly charge the trespassing. 00:32:10
Regardless of that, we've complied and. 00:32:14
Frank to God who is here? 00:32:16
Sir, would you please stand? 00:32:18
It's my understanding this gentleman has spoken with Nick. 00:32:21
His credentials are significant. It's my understanding you have his resume. 00:32:24
And he has been to the farm yesterday and today. 00:32:28
He has inspected the entire property. 00:32:31
He has inspected it for purposes of compliance with your rules and regulations and he can tell you better than I. 00:32:33
But those are those are in place. 00:32:39
Thirdly. 00:32:42
We're happy to see that MDOT doesn't have a change to the traffic control requirements. 00:32:43
Given given the high traffic on 111. 00:32:48
I'm not surprised. So I appreciate you getting that because that's been a bone of contention and we didn't have. 00:32:52
The ability to get that kind of a timely response, you did it and we agree. 00:32:57
We intend to have. 00:33:01
Traffic control for this event you've ordered that we intend to comply. 00:33:02
With respect to the hours of operation. 00:33:06
DNR does publish hours of operations for shooting. 00:33:11
And it's typically 1/2 hour before sunset of sunrise and 1/2 hour after sunset. 00:33:14
Now the reality of this is simple. 00:33:18
These people aren't going to put the people who are patronizing that facility. 00:33:20
And and who who pay to be safely enjoying that facility. They're not going to put them at risk. Never have and never will. 00:33:24
And so I if you're looking for a benchmark on ours. 00:33:30
That's a simple one. 00:33:34
And as Mr. Walton said when he was up here to you before I. 00:33:35
If if this was not. 00:33:39
The subject of these special exceptions. 00:33:41
It they could use this property in a fashion that they determine and no one else could control it. 00:33:43
They could. They could do things up to the property. 00:33:47
We're not here to debate that. You've made your recommendations previously. 00:33:50
We've abided by those. 00:33:53
Finally. 00:33:55
Attack event. It's here. 00:33:56
Rob Solinsky is here. 00:33:58
He is the manager of that with with the owner, Sean. They're both here. 00:34:00
If you've never been to the farm. 00:34:06
Into the farm. I would encourage you to do it. I, I, my wife's here. 00:34:08
And she and I got to write up to. 00:34:12
For the vendor villages and I'm just going to tell you. 00:34:14
If there if there are more beautiful places in Floyd County, I'm not sure what they would look like because it's absolutely 00:34:17
gorgeous. 00:34:19
Well, what's important to see on that property and that location? 00:34:22
The neighbors can't see him. 00:34:27
So we talked about all kinds of of, of, of innuendo and. 00:34:29
And make all kinds of accusations. The reality of it is this is a responsible use of that property. 00:34:34
Consistent with the rules and regulations that you've imposed. 00:34:39
And as an example. 00:34:43
For those of you who have not been there in the last 24 hours. 00:34:45
Remember, last year is at 5 Mile Lane. 00:34:48
A5 mile lane there. There was a complaint made. 00:34:51
Because there were people that had bows. 00:34:53
Or archery equipment on that. 00:34:56
Remember that complaint? 00:34:58
You go look. 00:35:00
They have a target set. 00:35:01
Towards the water if you hadn't been on the property and I think. 00:35:03
Mr. Unruh and Mr. Bieber Hauser, you have. 00:35:07
Mr. Roberts, don't know if you have or not. 00:35:09
But you know that there's water behind that target and they're shooting down. 00:35:11
Mr. Solinsky will will confirm and Mr. Degat will as well. Who's an independent person? 00:35:15
Who I understand. 00:35:21
Staff have agreed is going to be your third party observer. 00:35:23
He will validate to you that there are no shots. 00:35:27
Going near anybody's property. 00:35:30
Outside of this, outside of the. 00:35:32
So rather than me tell you those things. 00:35:34
If Joe you want to add something or. 00:35:37
If the gentleman who are here that that are not connected to the farm, you want to hear from them. 00:35:40
We would use the balance of our time for that purpose. 00:35:45
It's up to them, right? 00:35:47
Yeah, it's up to you guys if you want to introduce any of those people to come up and speak. 00:35:48
And while we're bringing up, I just want to say thank you very much. I know it seems like we're here once a month. 00:35:52
And I know that the board has the same feelings as we do, so we say thank you very much and we just want to make sure we get, you 00:35:57
know, a shot to show you what we can do and abide by the rules. So appreciate that. Thank you. 00:36:03
Just state your name and address for the record if you will. 00:36:13
Brock Zielinski, 4019 Chieftain Rd. Irwin, PA. 00:36:15
15642. 00:36:19
OK. 00:36:20
I'm a representative Total Archer challenge. I'd be happy to answer any questions you guys have about our operation or any any 00:36:22
history that you know how we operate our business and. 00:36:26
I thank you, Cortana. 00:36:31
So how many of these events do you do a year? 00:36:33
So we do. 00:36:36
Right now will be 13 events this year based around the United States. 00:36:37
And as far as your safety record? 00:36:40
So we have shoot over. 00:36:43
25,000,000 arrows over the last 14 years we have over 250,000. 00:36:45
Shooters total unique people across the last 14 years. 00:36:50
We've had one injury that was. 00:36:53
Not. 00:36:56
From. 00:36:57
Negligence on total archery challenge every the last 14 years. OK. 00:36:58
Alrighty, and you're putting on the event that's. 00:37:01
Coming up. Is that correct? Yes, Sir. 00:37:04
OK, alright. 00:37:05
Larry So. 00:37:07
My understanding is you have multiple courses out on this property. 00:37:10
Yes, Sir. 00:37:14
And there will be multiple groups of people. 00:37:15
At the big one group at this one and one group of that one, so. 00:37:17
Yes, Sir. 00:37:21
Will there? What kind of monitoring do you do of the new people? 00:37:23
While they're on the course, so we release groups a Max of 16 people. 00:37:27
Every 30 minutes. 00:37:32
And we have a staff of anywhere from 2:00 to. 00:37:33
Four people on the site. 00:37:35
All the time. 00:37:38
And so the way we operate our event is that everything is accessible by machine. 00:37:39
So no ones ever shooting across the road so it's safe. So we have guys roaming the mountain. 00:37:43
Constantly to make sure they're safe. 00:37:48
And following the rules and if someone should break a rule, they are ejected from the event permanently. 00:37:49
OK. Can I ask the question? It's your time. So I asked a question earlier. Tell them about the safety course. 00:37:56
That they now have to access. 00:38:02
Pass and the condition it is before they can sign up for. 00:38:05
So every single person prior to shooting or attending one of our events has to. 00:38:08
During the registration process has to watch a safety video. 00:38:13
That walks you through. 00:38:15
All the. 00:38:17
The guides. 00:38:18
Even answering questions is for course etiquette and how to behave professionally and responsibly. 00:38:19
Prior to signing up if they show up. 00:38:23
And have not signed up or watched that video. Signed the waiver saying they have. They're not allowed to attend or shoot on the 00:38:25
event. 00:38:28
10 more thanks. Thank you. 00:38:33
Yep. 00:38:35
Nick, do you want to start another 10 minutes? Because they've only utilized 10 minutes. 00:38:37
Sorry, you're OK. 00:38:45
Frank Degas, 617 Evergreen Dr. Clarksville, IN. 00:38:50
And I've watched these. 00:38:55
Safety video they have. 00:38:57
It's one of the best ones I've ever seen. 00:38:59
And I've walked the boundaries of the targets. 00:39:03
And everyone of us facing away. 00:39:07
From the property. 00:39:10
I think the closest was about 85 yards parallel. 00:39:11
To that property line. 00:39:16
And it's shooting into a bank. 00:39:18
There's one at the far end towards Gap Hollow Rd. 00:39:21
It's far enough away, it's elevated and they're shooting down. 00:39:25
So I did not find any targets. 00:39:29
That were. 00:39:32
Unsafe. 00:39:34
Now are are you? 00:39:35
The gentleman that's been picked to be out there for to observe the event. 00:39:37
Is that OK? OK. 00:39:42
Alright, I got you. 00:39:43
All right, knock it out. 00:39:44
Link here to the video if you all want it. 00:39:45
OK, we can. 00:39:48
Yeah, you can provide that if you'd like. 00:39:50
Thank you. 00:39:55
And So what you've done is obviously before, correct, OK. 00:39:57
OK. 00:40:01
All right, so you have your experience at it then? Yes, setting up ranges and. 00:40:01
Shooting. 00:40:06
OK. 00:40:07
Alrighty, any questions anymore? 00:40:08
Ask another question? Sure, go ahead. 00:40:11
I asked you earlier, I met you for the first time today. 00:40:15
If if you observe a safety violation, what what? 00:40:19
Where Where is your loyalty? 00:40:23
It's reported immediately. 00:40:24
And if you observe an unsafe condition. 00:40:26
What, what? What were you then doing? Reported immediately or? 00:40:29
So so. 00:40:32
If you see something that you're concerned about, what whether it's a violation or not? 00:40:34
You will report it immediately. 00:40:38
Based on what you've been asked to do. 00:40:42
And then finally tell the board when you're going to be. 00:40:43
I'll be there Friday, Saturday and Sunday. 00:40:46
During the duration of the shoot. 00:40:49
So what? What? 00:40:51
What does? 00:40:52
Uh, system have you set up to be able to get ahold of whoever you need to get ahold of if you do find something? 00:40:53
And you need to report it. How do you do that? 00:40:59
My cell phone, I'll have their numbers. And who is that person you call? 00:41:03
To tack. 00:41:07
Are to the people at the farm OK? 00:41:08
OK. 00:41:11
Or repealed provided reports. 00:41:11
No, no, exactly. But do you? Do you want him to have your number too? 00:41:15
OK, OK. 00:41:20
OK. 00:41:23
We bought, we also talked about an hour ago about the reports that you're going to make to the board after the event and you're 00:41:25
familiar with that and that's been explained to you. 00:41:28
Yes, Sir. And that's a report that you will prepare based on the information you're getting. 00:41:31
Yes, Sir, nobody's going to prepare them on your behalf. 00:41:34
No, Sir. 00:41:37
Good enough for me. What about you? Anything. 00:41:39
OK. Thank you, Sir. You're welcome. 00:41:42
Yeah, yeah. 00:41:46
Arjun van Buell. 00:41:52
4546. 00:41:54
Concrete Rd. Georgia. 00:41:56
Ball Ground GA. 00:41:58
OK, alright. 00:41:59
Can you just just give us a little bit of background on yourself? 00:42:01
What you do and of course of year. 00:42:05
What your experience is just so the board can understand what you do. 00:42:07
So my background was in environmental remediation. 00:42:10
And. 00:42:14
Through that, I came in contact. 00:42:15
With cleaning up a gun range. 00:42:17
And doing that, that was really what I like to do. So I started doing that. 00:42:20
As the only thing I do and. 00:42:25
I've been doing that exclusively for the last 20 years. 00:42:27
And it's not a cleanup, it's a reclamation, so. 00:42:30
We go to a gun club. 00:42:34
And if there is enough lead? 00:42:36
Then we offer to do it for free. 00:42:38
And then we give them a share of the revenue from the sales that we get from the lead. 00:42:40
And I've been to over 200 ranges. 00:42:45
Uh, reclaimed. Probably 100. 00:42:50
So I've tested all those other ones. 00:42:53
When they weren't sufficient. 00:42:54
Most of them I can weed them out over the phone. 00:42:57
You know, without going there. 00:42:59
I've been talking to Joe for several years, trying to. 00:43:01
Tell him you know this is not worth it. We don't need to do it. 00:43:05
But. 00:43:08
He was under the gun and we did it last year and. 00:43:09
You know I never charge for my services. 00:43:12
But I never do it if it's not worth it either and. 00:43:14
I felt really bad for having. 00:43:17
To do that place. 00:43:19
Because there was. 00:43:21
Hardly any lead and and I don't want to just go through the motions. 00:43:22
So we normally we put in. 00:43:25
Say 6. 00:43:27
Full 1 yard buckets of dirt. 00:43:28
And we get. 00:43:31
3000 lbs of lead out of it. 00:43:32
And I had to go through like 200 buckets of dirt. 00:43:34
To fill up one bag. 3000 lbs of lead. 00:43:37
And. 00:43:40
You know, the conditions were dry. We showed up the year before. 00:43:41
And it was too wet. 00:43:44
And then we came back when it was. 00:43:45
Drier and super dry. 00:43:47
But even under those conditions, it was very hard. 00:43:49
And we went through an incredible amount of dirt and I think we came up with two bags or. 00:43:51
5 or 6000 lbs of lead. 00:43:56
And then you know, what do I charge the man? I I felt so bad. 00:43:59
Even. 00:44:02
Doing it. 00:44:03
But I you know, I charge them what I would make on a. 00:44:05
On an average job. 00:44:07
And it's against my own interest to even go do an average job. 00:44:09
Because I'd rather do a good job, right? 00:44:12
And. 00:44:15
That's why my recommendation is do it when it's. 00:44:16
When it's ready. 00:44:19
Now the the. 00:44:20
And I I test so many sites and I see so many people that haven't. 00:44:21
Maintain their property the right way to PH's off. 00:44:25
And then the lead is corroded. 00:44:28
And then the bags weigh a lot less. 00:44:31
You lose a lot because it falls apart. 00:44:33
And then I've also seen places where they have the best management practices in place and they line the place, keep the. 00:44:35
PH neutral. 00:44:41
Or it's slightly above and then there's zero corrosion. 00:44:43
The lead looks like. 00:44:46
Pristine like it looks in California, where it never rains. 00:44:47
Even the Minnesota I've seen places where there wasn't 0 corrosion just because they. 00:44:50
They lined it and kept it. pH. 00:44:55
And then it can accumulate. 00:44:57
When it accumulates, you can also reclaim a bigger area because. 00:45:00
It starts heavy in the middle and it. 00:45:04
Gets thinner. 00:45:07
So because there's more lead, when you do it after 20 years, you will be able to get a huge. 00:45:08
Double the area or triple the area because. 00:45:13
It takes longer for it to. 00:45:15
To Peter out. 00:45:17
Right where it's not worth. 00:45:18
You know, throwing it in the machine and getting. 00:45:19
That let's show. 00:45:21
Doing it more often is only going through the motions and it's not benefiting anybody. 00:45:23
On top of that. 00:45:28
You know it. 00:45:29
It disturbs the grass which holds the soil in place. 00:45:30
You know, and this is. 00:45:33
Not good for erosion if you. 00:45:34
If you disturb everything. 00:45:37
So there's a lot of. 00:45:39
Pros to waiting longer. 00:45:40
And there's no benefits to doing it soon. 00:45:42
So so I have a question. 00:45:45
And probably put you on the spot, but. 00:45:47
OK, I thank the recommendation from. 00:45:49
Our planner is 10 years or 10 million shots or if the pH reaches a. 00:45:52
Certain level. 00:45:57
OK, you've been on site. 00:45:59
And in your experience? 00:46:01
My recommendation would be. 00:46:03
If the place floods then immediately check the pH. 00:46:05
Because then it. 00:46:09
You know it could be neutralized by the all the water going through. OK, Otherwise just lime it. 00:46:10
You know, once a year. 00:46:15
Or once every two years as long as the pH is still good. You don't have to lime it, but a flood or you know, could change that so. 00:46:16
And then as far as? 00:46:23
When to do it, I would go by the square foot sample. 00:46:25
So if there's an if. 00:46:28
If the square foot area. 00:46:30
Like in one square foot. 00:46:33
Of ground. 00:46:34
There would be 5 lbs of lead. 00:46:35
Then I would say. 00:46:37
It's great. Let's do it. 00:46:38
Because then I can do it. 00:46:40
It won't cost anything and I can give a. 00:46:41
A percentage back. 00:46:44
And yeah, I appreciate I have to interrupt you, but I appreciate. 00:46:45
You know, as far as the cost, but obviously the board would work what we're concerned about. 00:46:49
Is the safety for the for the public OK as far as you know, the water source and things of that nature, you've seen the site. 00:46:53
And you've seen, you know, the soil. What's this is this is a 0 risk site because there is no. 00:47:01
There's no steep hills where it can wash off. 00:47:07
OK, if if the river flooded and it started to flow, it would be a slow flow and it wouldn't move the lead. 00:47:09
OK, the lead only moves if it's on a steep slope and there's like a gully. 00:47:15
Right. Even in creeks. 00:47:19
It never leaves the Creek. It lays right in the bottom of the Creek and it just, it doesn't move. 00:47:21
So. 00:47:25
From a safe, from an environmental standpoint. 00:47:27
You have to prevent corrosion. 00:47:30
And the only way to prevent corrosion is by. 00:47:32
Keeping the pH. 00:47:35
Right, right. 00:47:36
And since. 00:47:37
Since it's. 00:47:38
You know it's laying on the ground. 00:47:39
And it gets rained on and and and it could corrode. 00:47:41
You you have to stop that by keeping the. 00:47:46
With the line, With the line, yeah, just. 00:47:49
Natural, natural product which helps grass which is good. So, so you mentioned that you eventually early on was environmental. 00:47:52
OK. Do you have any degree in our environmental or you just? 00:47:59
Cleaned up environmental. No, I was at microbiologist actually. OK, OK. 00:48:04
Yeah, you've still got 34 seconds less than that. 00:48:11
You're, you're also familiar, having expected the property and what equipment they have, they're able to do their own testing. 00:48:15
Yeah. I mean anybody that has a winery or a farm or. 00:48:20
Can do their own pH testing, right? So the idea that they got to pay a third party to come in and do the sampling and testing, is 00:48:24
that necessary here? No. 00:48:28
No, that's all the questions. So, so would you recommend with seeing the site? 00:48:32
Yeah. 00:48:37
And say in the shoot stations. 00:48:37
And you if you have the layout of the land, could you make a? 00:48:41
A. Relatively. 00:48:45
Intelligent. 00:48:46
Recommendation where? 00:48:49
To test regularly in that area where it's going. 00:48:51
The so so it's lined up where everything shoots, kind of. 00:48:54
You know, in the middle. 00:48:58
So you. 00:48:59
If you want to test the heaviest area. 00:49:01
And the shot will spread itself kind of evenly. 00:49:04
So. 00:49:07
If it's, if it's, if you're not, I mean, if you can see that shot laying there. 00:49:08
Or if you see it landing. 00:49:12
Or if you look at the layout you can immediately tell this is where I have to go test. 00:49:15
And then when you test that area. 00:49:19
You're looking for 5 lbs. 00:49:22
5 lbs of square foot in one square foot. So you you dig the dirt up. 00:49:24
And if there's been? 00:49:28
If there's been flooding, then you could have. 00:49:29
Several layers of dirt. 00:49:31
Right. Because it could deposit, you know, a layer of seals, right? 00:49:33
So you go down until you see no more lead. 00:49:36
Usually that's three or 4 inches. 00:49:39
One square foot. You can put it in a 5 gallon bucket or two buckets if you need. 00:49:41
And then just wash it out. Wash all the. 00:49:46
With a garden hose. 00:49:49
And the lead will just fall right to the bottom and then you weigh it. 00:49:50
OK, and clarify something. 00:49:53
Go ahead. 00:49:55
The the the £5 per square foot makes it profitable. 00:49:56
For you. 00:50:00
To come do it. 00:50:01
And not have to pay the property owner. 00:50:02
Where it's not like you would prefer to do. 00:50:04
Yeah, yeah, yeah. His question was is there a location? So, so you've already established my understanding is. 00:50:07
You're not going to find a £5 per square foot LOC. 00:50:13
Far last time we did it. His question as I understood it. 00:50:16
Is is there a way? 00:50:20
Under in these circumstances. 00:50:22
To identify the most. 00:50:24
Idealistic areas to sample. 00:50:26
For the pH, yeah, that's what that's what. So that is in the heaviest area, in the heaviest shot falls. Can you could you identify 00:50:28
that for them on a map? 00:50:32
So I'd like to make that part of whenever the testing we have a map and. 00:50:39
Where his recommendation for the. 00:50:43
Whatever. So thank you very informational. Anybody else? 00:50:46
The last thing I'd like to say is you can in a normal situation. 00:50:49
You can reclaim. 00:50:53
Easily down to 1 LB per square foot. 00:50:54
So I know it said £2 per square foot. 00:50:57
But that's an average. 00:51:00
So. 00:51:02
If you're starting in an area with. 00:51:03
5 lbs or 10 lbs. I mean, I've seen 20 lbs. 00:51:05
Then you keep working, working, working. 00:51:09
To where it gets below 1 LB a square foot and then it becomes questionable. 00:51:11
OK. Still keep going. OK. 00:51:15
On the testing, no one on the on the reclamation. 00:51:17
When you actually start reclaiming. OK, gotcha. Yeah, OK, Yeah. So if you're testing it now and it's half a pound. 00:51:21
And it's been five years. 00:51:27
Then you know you need five more years to get to 1 pension. 00:51:28
Gotcha. OK. If the shot is equal, I mean, obviously just in the heaviest area. I got you just in the. 00:51:31
Heaviest area OK. 00:51:37
Yeah, thank you. Because you got you got dealing with five acres. 00:51:38
15 acres. Sorry, 1550 acres of the whole thing. Where? 00:51:42
Of which 15 acres would be the reclaimable area. OK. 00:51:46
All right, we're out of time. So all right, thank you. 00:51:50
All right. OK at this time. 00:51:52
The anybody. 00:51:56
Anybody like to speak in favor of this? 00:52:00
Adam, please come forward this time state your name and address for the record. 00:52:03
Seeing that, nobody came forward. 00:52:12
We'd now like to open up for anybody in opposition. 00:52:15
And. 00:52:18
Welcome. Thank you, Mr. Ram. 00:52:21
State your name. Good evening, Board. My name is John Hughes. I'm an attorney from the law firm of Bozeman. Kenny Evans. 00:52:24
Address at 111 Monument Circle, Suite 2700, in Indianapolis. 00:52:30
It's good to see you Miss Runner and Mr. Ripple Hauser again. I feel like I was just saying a. 00:52:35
Thank you. Nick had a baby one time. We're down here. I feel like I know you guys so well. Excited down here so much. 00:52:39
Good to see you again. I'm here again representing 2 families. It's Paul and Julie Riley who are. 00:52:44
Here with me and Andrew and Angela Lush. We're also here with me. 00:52:50
And we're their neighbors to the farm. 00:52:55
And. 00:52:57
I appreciate you giving me a little bit extra time. I'll try not to take all of it. I don't know if anybody else wants to speak, 00:52:58
but I'll try to. 00:53:01
Leave some on the clock if I can. 00:53:04
I've given you a few materials here that are in front of Miss Fox. 00:53:06
That may help you follow along this binder. 00:53:10
I submitted these materials and I'll apologize they were sent late. 00:53:12
As you all know this, I was hired the day after you had your last meeting on March 9th to come back down here. I was hard hired on 00:53:16
March 10th. 00:53:19
At that time I understood I had until April 14th. Probably shouldn't have taken this assignment with all the work I had going on. 00:53:22
To get here today, but since the meeting got moved up I just did the best I could and I apologize if they're late. 00:53:29
They were given to you late. 00:53:34
But in this I'll go over this PowerPoint. 00:53:35
Kind of slide deck here. That'll be the easiest way to follow along and we'll reference those binder materials if we need to. So 00:53:39
if you'll turn to page 2 of this, document the slide deck. 00:53:43
Just for clarification, sorry, do you have an extra set for staff? 00:53:47
That's OK, I just want to make sure. 00:53:52
We have one. 00:53:54
I just want to make sure that nobody that we have a set to go into the record. 00:53:56
You don't have one, I'll take one, but I just want to make sure we have a set to go into the record one for the board members. 00:54:00
There's another one there, Mr. 00:54:06
Phillips used one. 00:54:08
Can add it to. Sorry to interrupt. 00:54:09
So the materials that I've submitted to you, I just want to summarize those for you. 00:54:20
In this binder, you'll find a letter of today's date. In that letter, I explained why. 00:54:25
From my perspective as a lawyer, the farm is not established. The five. 00:54:29
Elements that they must establish to meet their burden on this special exception. 00:54:34
I also presented a staff 7 YouTube videos which were really interesting to watch for me. 6 of them are. 00:54:38
Three are from a 2025 Total Archery Challenge. Three are from a 2024 Total Archery Challenge. 00:54:44
They're content creators who are out on the course. 00:54:49
And they they really give you a feel for what's going on, how they shoot back in the woods, how they climb these hills. 00:54:52
I'll tell you it's fascinating and interesting, but it gives you a much better context for content for what happens. 00:54:58
In the written materials in this binder, I've put exhibits A through F in here as well. 00:55:03
Exhibit AI took the videos and I tried to distill them to a quick narrative to give you some screenshots of them, so you can flip 00:55:08
through pictures there if you want. Really, the reason I was providing them is Mr. Beeblehauser at the. 00:55:13
Think it was a November meeting you you mentioned like we're not sure how these arrows were getting to the lush property over 00:55:18
these hills. 00:55:21
And if you watch those videos, you'll see that's where they're shooting. They're back in the hill, shooting on top of the hill, 00:55:24
shooting down. You'll see the one of the content creators indicated that they were shooting at angles of 20° positive and 33° 00:55:29
negative, which is different from what staff has recommended in terms of parallel. So that's why that's provided is for that 00:55:34
context. You'll also see a couple areas where they were shooting close to the Riley residence just to give you some. 00:55:39
Appreciation for the concerns my clients have. 00:55:45
Exhibit B is an I'm not a lead reclamation guy. Arjun knows has forgotten more about lead reclamation than I myself will know. So 00:55:49
I'm not up here to tell you how that should happen or not, but I have provided a material from. 00:55:56
An individual named Chris Abel. Chris Abel is certified in heavy metals. 00:56:02
And removal of heavy metals from properties and has done. 00:56:08
Gun ranges and I asked him if you just look at this material and say what we need and he's provided an Exhibit B some areas, he 00:56:10
thinks there's some gaps of things that we ought to look at. 00:56:14
I think we ought to distrust an expert, and so that's kind of what I think we should do on that rather than try to come up with 00:56:19
rules on our own. I don't think we'll ever get the right rules, so. 00:56:22
We should trust an expert. 00:56:27
Exhibit C is a history of the boundary and landscape and that section I talked about the fact that. 00:56:28
The 200 yard boundary that we have today. 00:56:34
That was actually at. 00:56:36
The farms request, that was in 2021. In September they came forward and said. 00:56:38
We need to move our boundary. We don't ever need to move closer to the Riley property, but give us this other area over here in 00:56:43
the yellow in the South. 00:56:46
Eastern part of the property. 00:56:50
So I gave that history and also the landscaping. Mr. Phillips mentioned the landscaping. There was landscaping installed. I'll 00:56:52
show you kind of the general area where that was and why. 00:56:55
New landscaping is needed for these new requests. 00:56:59
Exhibit D This on this chart says location targets from 24. That's actually 25. Those are locations that Mister Loesch identified 00:57:02
where he saw targets next to his property from last year. 00:57:06
Exhibit E is minutes from 2021 and because we had a partial meeting on March 9th, I just provided a transcript of that, but I 00:57:12
asked the quarter to provide. 00:57:16
That's Exhibit F So if you turn to tab, page three of my my slide deck here. 00:57:20
This is a real summary of why we think it should be denied. There's five elements. We don't think we've met them. 00:57:25
That's in my letter. 00:57:30
If the board is going to grant it, we can just move on to talk about what those are, but in general? 00:57:31
I don't believe they met the unnecessary hardship. They're operating a gun range, they're operating an archery range. They have to 00:57:36
show you that they can't operate some profitable operation and they have been since 2019. So I don't think that's. 00:57:41
Shown also as I mentioned, the border was created by them. So I think it's a self-imposed hardship. Indiana law says you can't get 00:57:47
it for that. 00:57:50
And I also don't think they've shown peculiar condition. 00:57:54
I think health, safety and welfare will be harmed if we move closer to people's properties. I think their property values be 00:57:57
adversely affected if we move closer. 00:58:00
And the comprehensive plan, I appreciate what what Mr. Walden said, He knows that comprehensive plan better than I do. I just 00:58:04
point out that in general, this area is supposed to be agricultural and this is an expanding commercial use. 00:58:09
OK, so. 00:58:15
Moving on to Tab 4 because. 00:58:15
I could go on and on about why legally I think it shouldn't be granted, but let's just get to if we're going to grant this, what's 00:58:17
reasonable? 00:58:20
And I kind of want to take the temperature down just a little bit. 00:58:23
I want to thank Mr. Phillips. Mr. Phillips and I had some really good conversations in the last week. Weren't able to get a 00:58:25
resolution, but I got to tell you it was a breath of fresh air to have a good conversation about. 00:58:30
Can we agree to to figure this out? 00:58:35
I also want to thank the board because I know I've left here several meetings thinking. 00:58:37
Man, that didn't turn out the way that I was hoping. And then I'm driving up the Annapolis. By the time I got home, I thought, 00:58:41
well, the board really balanced the interests of everybody. So I know it's a tough job. I don't envy your job, but I appreciate 00:58:45
that you. 00:58:48
Considered my clients concerns, considered the farms operations and found a good balance so. 00:58:52
Here's what we propose is a good balance in general. 00:58:56
I think the staff report is workable, as Mr. Phillips said, with a few tweaks. 00:58:59
First of all. 00:59:04
We believe the boundary needs to be 300 yards per shotgun now. I think that's in. 00:59:05
Anticipated in their request because they didn't ask to move the shotgun targets for Clay. 00:59:09
But we don't see any reason to move. 00:59:14
Upland shotgun game hunts closer to the property. That'll bring noise closer to the property. 00:59:16
And the staff report? 00:59:20
Has a. 00:59:22
Boundary that says no shot fall in that 300 yard buffer. I think that's going to be confusing. 00:59:23
Who's going to track where the shot fall goes? I think a much easier rule is usually you can shoot. Here's where you can't shoot. 00:59:27
And we should just keep that at 300 yards. 00:59:32
Same for archery. 00:59:34
Staff recommended a 50 yard buffer for archery, but it's a shot fall area. I think that's going to be difficult to implement so. 00:59:36
We think it should be 50 yards and shoot away from the property. 00:59:43
If you're shooting back towards the property, it can't land in that 50 yard zone. 00:59:46
I think that's consistent with what staff says, except we think that 50 yards should be no shooting in. 00:59:49
And no shooting out if you turn to the next page. 00:59:54
I'm not as good of a cartographer as Mr. Walden, so I borrowed your work. Sorry, Mr. Walden. 00:59:56
I changed his work a little bit, as all good lawyers do. 01:00:02
So Mr. Walden put together a archery boundary or a boundary map and and I suggest what I think is reasonable, so. 01:00:05
As I understand staff report, they're saying essentially someone could stand on the 5 yard line right outside my client's property 01:00:14
and shoot. 01:00:17
Out away from the property. 01:00:20
We don't think that's reasonable for a commercial use of the property to be that close to this rural residential area and it's 01:00:22
always been 300. 01:00:25
So we think moving it back. 01:00:29
That 5 yard buffer should just be the landscape buffer. 01:00:30
And although it goes around the whole property, the only area I'm really concerned about is around the Riley residence. 01:00:33
The 10 yard set back that was from a prior docket and I don't think there's any requests to remove that. 01:00:39
That's the area on the far right of the map that you'll see there. 01:00:43
Then we have the 50 yard. 01:00:47
Buffer. I've called it the 50 yard archery shot. No shot into or out of area. 01:00:49
So don't, don't shoot. 01:00:53
Arrows in there. 01:00:55
From there, and don't shoot arrows into there. I think that's an easy rule to follow. We can mark the boundary. 01:00:56
Everybody knows what the rule. 01:01:00
And then on the hunting. 01:01:02
I I'm concerned about the shopfall area if anybody been has been up on game hunting or bird hunting. You follow the bird. So if 01:01:04
the birds moving into the area and you're already standing there. 01:01:08
You're gonna shoot, but then we have to figure out where the shot fell. I just think that's a really hard. 01:01:13
Hard rule to follow. 01:01:18
So if we just keep them 300 yards away, that keeps the noise down even for the upland game hunts and. 01:01:19
A reminder back in 13 that's what they were asking was upland game hunts. 01:01:24
And they said we don't need to get closer to the Riley property. 01:01:28
So that's the map I would request that we adopt. 01:01:30
Moving to the landscape buffering that we would request. 01:01:34
Staff. 01:01:38
I'm a little confused on where we are because I think in the applicants petition they said they were going to plant trees. 01:01:39
But I thought I heard them say when they came up here that they don't think they should have to plant more, so I'm not exactly 01:01:44
sure what the request is. 01:01:47
I think what staff said was we agreed trees should be planted but we should follow the rule of. 01:01:50
Planting about 6 foot at the time we plant them. 01:01:54
So that's what I'm going to go over and explain why we think that makes sense. 01:01:57
The Riley residence needs landscape buffering, and here's why. If you turn to page 7, you'll see. 01:02:01
I've zoomed in on that map and Mr. Walden created that green area is the parking area that they use for these tack events. They're 01:02:06
parking right next to the Riley. 01:02:10
Property. 01:02:14
So we have a heavy use of parking, which is a commercial use. 01:02:15
These events have been happening in the summer when the daylight hours are longer. 01:02:19
We're now doing it in the spring where it's going to be darker for periods, which means we're probably going to have light 01:02:23
pollution from those cars. 01:02:26
The yellow area that's circled on there is generally. 01:02:29
Where landscaping was installed. And that made sense because it was, you know, shooting within 300 yards. So the landscaping was 01:02:32
to buffer. 01:02:35
The shooting stations. 01:02:39
From the Riley property there was number landscaping. 01:02:41
Closer to them. So if we're going to move commercial activity closer to them. 01:02:43
We should buffer the area. 01:02:47
Mr. Unruh, I'm going to borrow your comments on the next page. 01:02:49
When we came here on buffering before and we talked about that issue back in 2013, there were little baby saplings in Mr. Hunter, 01:02:53
he said. Give him some 10 foot trees, hide the shooting stations, be a good neighbor. 01:02:58
I mean, that's what we're asking to do here as well. 01:03:04
And the next tab you'll or the next page, you'll see buffer types. Your your zoning ordinance, as you know, provides two different 01:03:08
buffer types, Type 1 and type 2. 01:03:11
Type 1 is to buffer, usually like uses. Type 2 is to buffer differing uses, usually residential from a commercial. 01:03:15
I acknowledge that their property is zoned the same as my clients property, however because it has an SE use on it that's a 01:03:23
commercial use. 01:03:26
And staff has recommended that we look to the type 2 buffer. 01:03:30
Type 2 buffer requires A6 foot tall berm with six foot tall trees on it. 01:03:33
This area may or may not be able to have a berm. I talked to Mr. Creedy about it. He was concerned that maybe we couldn't put a 01:03:37
berm down there and if we can't then we think 10 foot tall trees. 01:03:41
Would be 12 feet with a six foot tree on top of a six foot berm but 10 foot tall trees. 01:03:46
Would sure make a difference now. 01:03:50
And the types of trees staff report indicated deciduous or Evergreen, They should be Evergreen. That's the only way we're going to 01:03:53
get a shield. 01:03:56
Also, if there's any any archery, any arrows that happen to go that way. 01:03:59
A little deciduous trees not going to catch it. It's possible that an Evergreen tree might stop it, although it's not a Great 01:04:04
Barrier, a burn would be better. 01:04:08
And we would request those to be giant green Arbor vitae variety because those are make a really nice screen. 01:04:12
The next page on 10 I just showed you a picture from last year's docket of what the parking looks like so you get a feel for. 01:04:17
How intense of A use it really is right next to their property. 01:04:23
And where this little white box is, that's the Riley property, just right down in this area, so right on their boundary. We're 01:04:26
parking this many cars. 01:04:30
Next page I'm going to show you some views of what their property looks like as of yesterday. 01:04:34
First view shows commercial activity going off in the distance even when the range isn't shut up set up yet. 01:04:39
But as we bring people closer to that, there's just nothing to buffer anything for the Riley's. They'll have people effectively in 01:04:44
their backyard if you let 50 people shoot 50 yards to their property. 01:04:49
Next picture shows across the pond, same thing. We won't have any buffering to see what's going on there. 01:04:54
Next page shows for Mr. Riley's driveway. Same thing. If we could just put that buffering there. 01:04:59
It would really protect his privacy and his ability to use his property. 01:05:04
Next one is from the barn that's on the other side of the driveway, and you can still see, although it gets better that distance, 01:05:08
there's still an opening. 01:05:11
In that area. So buffering is really important for them, Landscape buffering. 01:05:14
The next picture on page 15. 01:05:18
You'll recall in 24, I showed you some pictures of some people hunting back right by his house. This is kind of that area. It's 01:05:21
raised right behind their house. So if we have people that are just. 01:05:26
15. 01:05:30
Which is what staff said. You can shoot in behind this property. They're gonna be looking right down into it. 01:05:32
If we're 50 yards away. 01:05:36
Then we have much more protection. But if they're going to be that close, we got to do something for landscaping in this site too. 01:05:38
Even though there's trees, we got to do better than that. 01:05:42
Next page on 16 Why do I ask for 50 yards? So here's the reason. 01:05:46
Noise. 01:05:50
Shotgun clearly or for the 300 yard buffer for shotguns. Shotguns are clearly loud. We should keep them away from residential use. 01:05:51
Archery. 01:05:58
Sure. 01:05:59
A bow isn't that loud, but when you have. 01:06:00
1000 people or 16 people at a time is the individual set from Total Architect Challenge going to a force at a time? 01:06:02
There's going to be noise of just joviality and enjoying the day. 01:06:08
And that's all great, but. 01:06:12
We should keep them further away from the property so that the Rileys and the Lushes can enjoy their property. 01:06:13
2nd is privacy invasion. I'll talk about that a little bit more in just a minute, but again, with no buffers, there's a lot of 01:06:18
invasion of privacy. 01:06:21
50 yards gives them a ton of property. 01:06:25
A lot of property. 01:06:27
Next is the farm asked for 10 yards in their application, So why would we give them five in the staff report, right? At the 01:06:29
minimum it should be 10. 01:06:32
But even staff said 10 yards was not reasonable and we agree. 01:06:35
We think the 50 yards that staff has come up with is reasonable, balances everybody's interest. Just don't shoot in it and don't 01:06:39
shoot towards it. 01:06:42
Also, that gives them 250 more yards. 01:06:45
Right from every point, that's a lot of square yards. 01:06:49
Of of that they currently have for archery. We think that's a very reasonable position for us to take and trying to be good 01:06:53
neighbors with them. 01:06:56
And it prevents activity like that in 2024. I honestly hate showing you this picture again, but page 17. 01:07:00
This is an individual relieving himself during the event. I'm sure most people don't do that. I'm sure this guy was making a dumb 01:07:05
decision. 01:07:09
But if we keep people away from the property, then we don't have to worry about someone making a dumb decision, so that's why 01:07:12
we're asking. 01:07:15
50 yards. 01:07:18
Finally. 01:07:19
On the other conditions, so that was all in the buffer. 01:07:22
Finally, on the other conditions. 01:07:24
We'd request no night shooting. I think that's effectively what staff report has said they asked to shoot. 01:07:26
Globe clays they've asked for that before. 01:07:31
Just do it during daytime hours as as the staff, we can live with the staff recommendation on that. 01:07:33
Lead reclamation, I agree I think with what everybody said, which is let's trust an expert. I don't think any of us can come up 01:07:38
with the right time to test the lead or trying to protect the water supply. I think that's the water supply originally made that 01:07:42
issue. 01:07:46
Mr. van Buell said in his materials that more lead is always better. That's what he said in those questions, and I'm not sure 01:07:49
that's true. I'm I'm not a lead. 01:07:53
Reclamationist. 01:07:57
But I think we had to have them hire an independent person. Maybe Mr. Van Buren is I've I've never met him before. Not suggesting 01:07:58
he's not, but. 01:08:01
To do the testing and to provide that testing, as staff has said, to the public water supply to you. 01:08:04
You guys can make a decision. 01:08:09
I don't think we should just come up with arbitrary numbers. 01:08:11
Finally, on the people. 01:08:14
My view of that is. 01:08:16
At the March 9th meeting, you all made a decision to remove the people cap for this one event. Kind of see how it goes. I think 01:08:17
that's a reasonable position. 01:08:21
So I think we should see how this weekend goes. 01:08:24
And if things go, great. 01:08:26
Then we should make it permanent. 01:08:28
If things don't go great, then we can discuss what would be an appropriate cap. So that's our position. Just to sum it all up for 01:08:29
you, because I know I went over a lot if you look at in my letter in the. 01:08:34
Reminder at page 7. 01:08:40
I've laid out the alternative relief and I'll just sum it all up as I as I've just said now. So here's the alternative relief. If 01:08:43
you approve their request, here's what we would ask for as. 01:08:47
A reasonable accommodation. 01:08:52
Any shooting boundaries should be no shots from or into set area. 01:08:54
So that means for shotguns remain at 300 yards. 01:08:58
For upland hunts, keep it up 300 yards around the Riley property. 01:09:01
And the lush property. 01:09:05
The other properties. 01:09:07
I don't know if other people here to talk about it but I'm just concerned about my 2 clients. 01:09:08
For archery. 01:09:12
The 50 yard buffer should be a number shooting into or out of. 01:09:13
So no shooting from or into the 50 yard buffer. 01:09:17
A landscape buffer of 6 foot tall berm with six foot tall trees, or if that's not possible, a 10 foot tall trees around the Riley 01:09:20
property. 01:09:24
Boundaries should be marked immediately. It sounds like that's already occurred. I don't know which boundaries they marked, but if 01:09:27
they mark the 50 yard one then we're good. 01:09:30
And then? 01:09:34
The there was a requirement about Marshalls. I didn't mention this in my presentation. 01:09:36
And I understood we're gonna have marshals out there kind of walking. I feel a little bit more comfortable about what Tack has 01:09:40
said. 01:09:42
But we did have some issues last year and I'm not sure that they know the board's rules, so we want to make sure whoever does this 01:09:45
knows the board rules. 01:09:48
At the March 9th meeting, I heard Mr. Korea say that it was going to be. 01:09:51
2 marshals and I would just note there's five courses out there. 01:09:55
Of over 100 targets. 01:09:59
I'm a little and it's back up in the woods. I'm a little concerned that two marshals is not enough, so I recommend it for every 01:10:01
course. Yes Sir. 01:10:04
The intent. 01:10:07
Was that? 01:10:08
The farm would have two marshals to. 01:10:09
In addition to. 01:10:12
Text Marshall. OK, that's very helpful. Thank you. Mr. Bewilder, I just want to make sure we have enough people out there 01:10:14
monitoring and if we do? 01:10:17
That's that's OK with us. We just want to make sure it's done correctly. 01:10:20
#2. 01:10:24
Remove the cap on people for this weekend's event only. 01:10:25
And then if if it works great, then we can make it permanent. If it doesn't, we can adjust. 01:10:28
For the night shoots, except staff's report, we don't think there should be any night shoots that just disturbs everybody's sleep. 01:10:33
And at the Riley property and that lead reclamation should be by an approved soil scientist. I've given you a guy, Chris Ables, 01:10:39
the guy that I I know. 01:10:43
Could be anybody but somebody who does this. As a soil scientist, I don't have anything further help. Anybody else from their 01:10:47
monsters wants to say something. 01:10:50
Yeah, sure. Go ahead, Paul. 01:10:55
We are down to a minute and 1/2. 01:11:00
My name's Paul Riley and I live at 3934 Five Mile Lane. 01:11:02
And I'm on page 7, just circled area. 01:11:06
Where Mr. Unruh had him add extra. 01:11:09
Trees and stuff that was built. 01:11:12
That is a six foot burn that was built when they dug the sand pits so they could drive across that ravine. 01:11:15
In the flooding, and I've been down there for a long time and I've been in my boat and watched it and been out in it and 01:11:21
everything, hauled neighbors around and the water comes directly over. It has not affected the burn. 01:11:26
So it's OK to put a berm around both sides of our property? 01:11:31
And plant trees on won't affect the thing because that area right there. 01:11:35
Is exactly where the current comes around over 111. 01:11:39
And gets with it and crosses 5 mile. 01:11:42
It won't affect my property at all. 01:11:44
Let me ask you one question along that line. 01:11:47
There's a power line easement that comes through there. 01:11:50
There is and it goes across your property also and into theirs. 01:11:52
Yes. 01:11:56
I don't believe we can. 01:11:57
We're not supposed to plant trees in that easement. 01:11:58
So. 01:12:01
We can probably do something what you're talking about, but we're not. 01:12:04
We can't plant those trees in. 01:12:08
That part of your property line where the easement go passes OK. 01:12:10
Could it be something that could be trimmed occasionally? 01:12:13
They'll come in and cut them down. 01:12:16
I've seen it in my neighborhood. They cut down to my freaking oak tree that was right one foot inside the. 01:12:18
Easement, but there's a lot of other property there that they could find. 01:12:23
Yeah, which used to be your tree. You planted it. Yeah. But all this through here, they could plant this. Yes, Sir, they could. 01:12:26
They make a lot of this. They could plant too, which would help us because they do bring campers in. 01:12:31
For both of all the, you know, the big bigger events. 01:12:37
And it blocked the parking in the campus here also. 01:12:40
I understand the car line, you're right. 01:12:43
Thank you. 01:12:46
I've got a point of clarification so. 01:12:51
And I think it's. 01:12:53
Stems from the fact that this is a very long report. 01:12:54
I did not. 01:12:57
Exclude the glow clays shooting standard in there. 01:12:59
It's just one that I didn't have a comment on within my recommendations, so I apologize for the. 01:13:04
I'm sorry. 01:13:12
The night shoot. The night shoot glows. Yeah, it's page four of the staff report item. 01:13:12
F from what was proposed. 01:13:18
I didn't have a an alteration to that and so I didn't include it in my staff recommendations. 01:13:20
Which is mostly what I was doing because I also didn't. 01:13:27
Reiterate the. 01:13:30
The Four. 01:13:33
Testings of pH. I didn't reiterate that I just. 01:13:35
Referenced it. 01:13:38
Later. 01:13:39
So I just wanted as a point of clarification there. 01:13:40
I apologize for the misunderstanding there with the. 01:13:42
Opposition. So we're not changing the night whatever's in there now. I did not have a recommendation to change item F that's 01:13:45
listed on page 4. 01:13:49
OK. 01:13:53
OK. All right. 01:13:57
Is there anybody else that? 01:13:59
Want to speak in opposition? I'd leave 2 more minutes if somebody else wants to come up. 01:14:01
Anybody else say anything? Come up, we'll give you 2 minutes. 01:14:06
Tell me two minutes on it, will you Nick, please? 01:14:09
We let the other guy run over with the lead guy, so. 01:14:12
I keep interactive now my name's. 01:14:16
David Wright. 01:14:18
6887 Budd Rd. New. 01:14:20
I am ready. 01:14:24
Member and a customer never built Water Corporation. 01:14:26
We've got whales. 01:14:34
It's 2 miles down from the. 01:14:36
Form I do not know. 01:14:38
What the correct intervals? 01:14:43
How much lead? 01:14:45
I don't know all those things. 01:14:47
But we do need to make sure. 01:14:50
That we don't contaminate. 01:14:54
Six parts per million of. 01:14:58
Is the maximum cap. 01:15:01
Contaminant. 01:15:03
In drinking water. 01:15:05
We're a little bit over one part as we stand. 01:15:08
In in in the uh. 01:15:14
Report just a minute ago. 01:15:16
I'm not here trying to say. 01:15:19
You gotta do this and you gotta do that. 01:15:22
But to me, we need people that actually. 01:15:26
Study and work with groundwater. 01:15:31
To look at this. 01:15:34
I mean, I'm here. 01:15:37
You know, 3 to 5 lbs per square. 01:15:38
Foot and all that. 01:15:41
But I wondered. 01:15:43
Just not all of the shooting ranges. 01:15:47
Are in an area that floods. 01:15:51
Where the runoff goes through other people's property. 01:15:53
But I I think. 01:15:58
That we need to keep in mind. 01:16:00
The Edwardsville. 01:16:04
Has 7500. 01:16:07
Members. 01:16:09
They sailed to the town of Greenville. They wholesale to them. 01:16:12
Also to UH Lanesville. 01:16:18
I'll just hit, You know I don't want. 01:16:22
It come up here 10 years or 20 years from now. 01:16:26
Yeah, yeah. You know, the groundwater is contaminated. 01:16:30
The pond there on the farm. 01:16:35
That's an open breach. 01:16:38
That's been concerning for a long time. 01:16:41
So like I said, I don't have the. 01:16:45
But I I don't want the decision to be made. 01:16:49
You know well if you got so much lead. 01:16:52
Then it's profitable, Duke, I think we need to look at it. 01:16:56
From the environmental part. 01:17:00
Add customers. 01:17:03
That's all I got, Sir. 01:17:05
You go ahead. I got a question. Are you with Edwardsville Water? That's my question. 01:17:09
Are you on the board? Are you a member or what? 01:17:13
I'm a member and I'm on the board. 01:17:16
I have I'm a licensed. 01:17:20
Water treatment operator. 01:17:23
Let me let me ask you a question. 01:17:27
I know that Floyd Knobs water comes in samples. 01:17:30
Gets a sample from me every year. 01:17:33
And and I get a report on what's in my water. 01:17:35
I'm assuming. 01:17:38
That. 01:17:39
Your water company samples the water that comes out of the ground. I don't know where this daily monthly. 01:17:40
How often do you do it but you test? 01:17:47
You have a lead test as part of those results. 01:17:50
And so you have a history of where the lead is right now. 01:17:53
How much lead is in your current water? 01:17:56
He said one part. 01:17:59
And and I think you said one part per million right now. 01:18:00
Yes, so. 01:18:04
You're monitoring that? 01:18:08
And I would expect that, if that. 01:18:11
Starts to change. 01:18:14
That you either. 01:18:16
Contact the farm and say hey we think we got an issue here are you contact? 01:18:18
The county and say hey, it's changed. 01:18:22
We need to do. 01:18:24
More testing or something to figure out why it's changed? 01:18:25
Well, that did concern me and that does concern me. I'm, I'm not, I'm, I'm with you there. 01:18:31
Because I don't want to drink a bunch of water with lead in it. 01:18:37
So, and then just to follow up on that question, because we're out of time and I don't need to, I don't want to sound rude, but. 01:18:41
That the farm's been there for correct me how many years? 01:18:46
566 years, OK in the six years has that. 01:18:52
Water sample changed No. 01:18:58
OK. All right. So I think what we're trying to do just to make you feel better, and that's been our concern from day one. 01:19:01
Is the testing. 01:19:07
Is mandatory. 01:19:08
They're going to turn that into us. We've got to see that. 01:19:10
So we're very concerned about that and I will tell you that if you guys see anything. 01:19:13
That even remotely. 01:19:18
Signals that there's a change in it. We would expect that we would hear from it. 01:19:20
But we appreciate your concern because we're as concerned as you are, Mr. 01:19:23
David. 01:19:27
Well, I'm like you. 01:19:27
I don't wanna, you know, be drinking lead. 01:19:31
I don't want to be shocked and again, I'm not here saying. 01:19:35
This is the right answer. 01:19:39
But we need to be diligent. 01:19:42
And look, you don't make sure we don't have a problem we can't get rid of. 01:19:45
Thank you very much, David. 01:19:50
OK. This time we got opened back up for the applicants to rebut any comments that were made. You got 5 minutes, is that right? 01:19:53
10, I'm 10 minutes, so I've known John. 01:20:01
And we had very healthy conversations, so. 01:20:08
It was a real departure from what I gather. 01:20:11
Had occurred before we were involved and and and so that everyone's clearer. 01:20:13
They drank the water that the gentleman was talking about. 01:20:16
So they they don't want to do anything to contaminate themselves and won't. 01:20:19
I just want to go through a couple things. First of all. 01:20:22
I didn't realize there's Mr. Degat. 01:20:26
Is 33 years with the Army Corps of Engineers. 01:20:28
He's an expert. 01:20:31
On trees and erosion and he just tapped me and said if you put. 01:20:32
Trees on a berm. 01:20:37
That will accelerate their erosion, and he can speak to that. 01:20:38
But but there's so many more issues Secondly. 01:20:42
If we planted a 10 foot tree. 01:20:45
Every 12 feet. 01:20:48
On a 660 by 750 property line. 01:20:51
At $1000 a tree. 01:20:55
That I say that right, 1000. 01:20:57
Let's just let's have him spend $412,500 to. 01:21:00
Landscape the property. 01:21:04
That's not why we're here. 01:21:05
And the information that you were given in the PowerPoint raises some great questions. 01:21:07
That are not relevant to this inquiry. 01:21:12
If every person. 01:21:15
Who owns a residential property? 01:21:16
It's zoned residential agricultural. 01:21:19
Was next to another residential agricultural. 01:21:21
Property. 01:21:24
And they wanted to start a business. 01:21:25
You would then be required to treat all those people, all those. 01:21:28
Businesses like the farm the same way. 01:21:32
Because part of what you weren't told. 01:21:35
And what the staff has said to you. 01:21:38
Is that all the five? 01:21:40
Conditions of approval that we're seeking here. 01:21:43
Your staff's already determined have been met. 01:21:46
So it's not a matter of negotiating. 01:21:49
Landscaping. 01:21:52
Secondly. 01:21:54
So we're opposed to the burns. Here's the thing. And Mr. Bieber, Hauser, you said it. The utility easements we can't encroach on. 01:21:55
There are other. 01:22:02
Other issues with that? 01:22:03
In addition to that. 01:22:05
I just encourage if you haven't been out there. 01:22:08
Restricting shooting. You can't, because now. 01:22:10
I misunderstood the the presentation because on page. 01:22:14
If you'll go to page. 01:22:18
Whose pages are we looking at? 01:22:20
Who's Who's is it? 01:22:22
Four of the of their presentation. 01:22:23
I read it and I thought, hey we do agree. 50 yards for an archery. 01:22:27
Until I heard what you can't shoot in it or out of it. 01:22:30
OK. 01:22:34
There's 0 reasonableness. 01:22:35
Saying that I can't stand. 01:22:37
That way their house is behind me. 01:22:39
And shoot that way. 01:22:42
And somehow that's going to be injurious to the problem. I don't, I didn't think that's what he meant. No, that's exactly what was 01:22:43
said. They they have asked you. 01:22:47
So so go back to the recommendations, I think what? 01:22:50
He's wanting you to stay 50 foot from the land before you start shooting, not to be in the 50 yard. 01:22:54
Zone and shoot out of it. I think it's what I heard him say. I'll defer a minute because that's exactly what they asked you to do. 01:23:00
They've asked you. 01:23:07
To restrict no shooting into or out of. 01:23:09
Because what Mr. Hughes said, as I heard it was there was some confusion about the shot fall. 01:23:11
I had the same confusion initially. 01:23:16
So if I'm mistaken I will stand down on that. 01:23:18
That's what was requested earlier and that that there's. 01:23:21
Well, I guess I'm confused right now myself. So between the two, between what you've said and what? 01:23:24
So I am a little confused because. 01:23:29
I'm happy to progressive your question. 01:23:33
Are you done? 01:23:35
A moment to clarify that is about. 01:23:38
I have one question for him and then we'll come back. We'll go back to this. 01:23:41
Into and out of stuff however you want to do it. I just want to clear. 01:23:45
Let me, let me, let me ask. 01:23:48
Mr. Hughes, Joe, one question. 01:23:51
Over. 01:23:54
How many shots do you? 01:23:55
Are being shot. 01:23:57
At per year. 01:23:59
No, I'm not talking Archer, I'm talking shotguns and stuff. 01:24:01
Are you figured 500? 01:24:04
Are you shooting 500? 01:24:06
You're shooting 3/4 of. 01:24:08
Yeah, between 300, between 7:50 and a million right now is the. 01:24:10
Is probably the average. 01:24:13
Is that just recent year or you think? It's been pretty consistent over the last two years, I'd say. 01:24:14
They're just past two years. 01:24:19
Yes. 01:24:21
OK. That's my only question. 01:24:22
Now let's get let's. 01:24:25
I'd like 30 because my notes were specific and I if I'm wrong, I'd be happy to be wrong. You got it. You got the floor. Go ahead. 01:24:28
Keep going. Mr. Hughes, would you come forward, please? 01:24:33
When it comes to the 50 foot. 01:24:40
Zone I think. 01:24:42
What I heard you asking for. 01:24:44
It's you don't want them standing in the 50 foot zone. 01:24:47
Even though their targets. 01:24:51
Their targets not on. 01:24:52
Their targets insect inward. 01:24:54
Yep, you don't want to. I assume you don't want them standing in that 50. 01:24:56
Yards. They start shooting at your target you want them to be on. 01:25:01
Yard 51 before they start shooting. Yeah, that's right. I think that's what Mr. Phillips was saying, yeah. 01:25:03
My, my, our request is right now that's the rule is no shooting in the 200 yard buffer. I think that's pretty. 01:25:08
Are you in it? Are you not? And so the easy way to say is 50 yard buffer makes sense so. 01:25:15
No shooting in that 50 yard buffer, just stay out of it and. 01:25:19
Shoot the other direction. 01:25:21
OK. Thank you. 01:25:24
That's what that's what I understood. And that's contrary to what? 01:25:26
The gentleman has indicated. 01:25:29
What what Mr. Walden has indicated is that there be no shot falling. Here's the thing. 01:25:31
If if. 01:25:36
If we were shooting things that could you. 01:25:38
Like like a boomerang. 01:25:40
Hey, you shoot it that way, it'll circle back. 01:25:41
That's one thing. We're not doing that. 01:25:43
And the 50 yard buffer is what it is. 01:25:46
But if we're shooting and and. 01:25:50
Mr. Degas already confirmed this. Everything is going away. 01:25:52
And internal. 01:25:55
So we're asking that because what's going to happen here? And ladies and gentlemen. 01:25:57
Is we're going to have the same thing that happened last year? 01:26:00
You'll get a complaint. 01:26:03
Will be in violation. 01:26:05
Will be on the 51st, but because of the depth perception of the picture, which is exactly what happened on five mile length. 01:26:06
We're going to have to spend more money to come back and defend something. 01:26:12
That has nothing to do. 01:26:15
Put the safety of their property. 01:26:17
With respect to the picture of the gentleman going to the bathroom. 01:26:20
Oh, that was from a. 01:26:23
Trail camera. 01:26:25
In the woods. 01:26:26
And it was 100 yards or more from the Riley property. 01:26:28
I understood. 01:26:32
And talking to John. 01:26:33
That it was next to their home and it was not. 01:26:35
So here's the thing. 01:26:37
I want to be very clear here. 01:26:39
If these people. 01:26:41
See somebody doing something inappropriate? They're gone. 01:26:42
Had had Joe or Marty? 01:26:46
Or anybody else, Rob? 01:26:49
Seen something like that? They're gone. 01:26:51
There's it's not a negotiable. 01:26:54
So that you know again. 01:26:55
That's not going to happen. 01:26:57
That we're not going to let that happen. 01:26:58
The other thing I wanted to talk about is this. 01:27:00
It's a little. 01:27:07
I'm I'm I'm impressed with the boldness of quoting Mr. Unruh. 01:27:08
But there was a part of this that wasn't read. 01:27:13
To Mr. Unruh's credit and his benefit. 01:27:16
What he said was. 01:27:19
Buy some 10 foot trees and at least try to eliminate some of the noise. 01:27:20
The board is here to protect the citizens of the county. Being a good neighbor and friendly is one thing, but you have to stop 01:27:25
some of the noise. 01:27:28
OK, you didn't set a minimum tree size. 01:27:31
Can they put trees? 01:27:35
And now? 01:27:36
This isn't a noise thing. 01:27:38
They've complied. This is I don't, I don't want to see something that I don't want to see. So the bottom line is this. 01:27:39
We've made the request as reasonable as we think it can. It's subject to your approval. 01:27:45
But the idea that the statute hasn't been met based on the recommendations of your staff. 01:27:50
So I would not want to be. 01:27:55
There is no legal challenge to the balance of what they've recommended and what you have the right to prove. 01:27:57
Want to say anything in addition? 01:28:03
We appreciate your time. Thank you very much for your time. All right, thank you. 01:28:05
Alright, I'm done. 01:28:09
Huh. I'm done. Yeah. OK. All right. 01:28:10
Alright. 01:28:14
All right, so that pretty well ends that portion. What now? We're looking for a ballot. 01:28:17
And permission I need. I need a few minutes. I need a few minutes of. 01:28:23
OK. 01:28:28
See if I want to make some adjustments. So give me a few minutes, take a breath. 01:28:30
Don't take a little break or whatever. 01:28:34
I'm not. You can go to the bathroom, but I I don't guarantee you might not miss something. 01:28:36
Yup. 01:28:46
You think it'll take you like 5 minutes? 01:28:49
What take a rush you but you think about 5 minutes? 01:28:58
Yeah, it could take a 5 minute pause or something. 01:29:03
You won't take about. 01:29:06
I would estimate it's probably take about 5:00-ish minutes, so if you may need to use rest, we're not going to. 01:29:08
Break the meeting but. 01:29:12
I think you're probably safe for about 5 minutes. 01:29:13
Can I just say, could we determine what you're talking about? Yeah, that's why I said turn off the lights. 01:29:15
Kyrie won't turn yours off to the place. 01:29:22
For 40 years you didn't have these. 01:31:12
I was just looking after your problem, I don't know. 01:31:36
I saw the movie. 01:32:12
The sun comes up the next day. 01:32:21
It's still like 2. 01:32:26
Rooster and a hand. 01:32:30
Little girl, they live with me. 01:32:32
16 month old. 01:32:38
Shake a bucket. It's pretty good. 01:33:30
Well, you've been. 01:33:41
Yeah, yeah. 01:33:59
Oh no. 01:34:09
Yeah. 01:34:14
All right. We're ready to get started back again. Thanks for your patience. 01:37:06
Everybody gets saddled down and we'll. 01:37:12
Go on with the meeting. 01:37:14
All right. As we stated, we're looking for a ballot. 01:37:18
Special exception ballot Docket FC O2-206-08. 01:37:22
Petition of the sporting club at the farm. 01:37:28
After careful review, the board finds. 01:37:30
That one, the special exception, will not be interest to the public health, safety, morals and gender welfare of the community 01:37:33
because. 01:37:37
Altering the boundary for hunting and archery. 01:37:40
Are found to. 01:37:44
Were found to, not. 01:37:49
Be interested in areas where the rugged train. 01:37:50
OK, nature. 01:37:53
Where the rugged? 01:37:56
Nature of the surrounding landscape and wooded buffers offer protection from neighboring properties and where archery and hunting 01:37:57
activities are not aimed towards these neighboring properties. 01:38:02
Additionally, hunting activities. 01:38:07
Are found to be less frequent. 01:38:09
And in less intensity. 01:38:11
Than shooting stations which are still limited. 01:38:12
In their location, so long as hunters are clearly aware of the property lines. 01:38:15
They better soil mining system will be improved the lead. 01:38:19
Mitigation efforts. 01:38:22
#2. 01:38:24
The use and value of the area adjacent to the property subject to the special exception. 01:38:25
Will not be affected in substantial inverse manner. 01:38:29
Because by right, the site currently allows for agriculture uses such as logging operations. 01:38:32
Which would have more of an impact? 01:38:37
Then the changes proposed to the current use. 01:38:39
A large portion of the site is buffered by substantial wooded areas. 01:38:42
Natural terrain. 01:38:46
Which is a dispersion. 01:38:47
Of proposed activities, limits to disruptions are provided through time restrictions. 01:38:49
Buffers. 01:38:54
Landscaping. 01:38:55
Are required to shield residential areas and requirements. 01:38:57
On the directions in which the shoots are allowed to be fired, shots are to be fired. 01:39:00
And landscaping provisions #3 The need for the special exception does arise from some condition peculiar to the property on file. 01:39:05
Because the sighting Compass is over 500 acres with highly irregular topography, extensive wooded buffers. 01:39:12
Elevation changes and multiple natural. 01:39:19
Unique to the site. 01:39:22
A large portion of the site is not buildable due to flooding or elevation limiting the. 01:39:23
Typical use of the property. 01:39:28
#4 the strict application of the terms of the Floyd County Zoning orders. 01:39:30
Growth result in. 01:39:34
Necessary hardship and the use of product because this use is not specified in the zoning ordinance. 01:39:35
Thus requiring a special exception. 01:39:40
The previous conditions are so restrictive that could be a. 01:39:42
Effectively opt. 01:39:46
Could could not effectively operate the business. 01:39:47
Previous experience by the applicant. 01:39:49
As managed this type. 01:39:51
Abuse reflection actual safe condition that. 01:39:53
This site provides due to the terrain. 01:39:56
And their operational capabilities? 01:39:58
#5. 01:40:01
Approval of the special exception will. 01:40:02
Contradict. 01:40:04
Will not contradict the goals and detectives. 01:40:05
Of the Floyd County comprehensive plan because of 2017 vision Floyd County comprehensive plan. 01:40:08
Details Community Pre. 01:40:13
Preferences which list. 01:40:15
A preference for more recreational and park activities and more entertainment and culture events. 01:40:17
Further, a sporting club fits within the. 01:40:22
Community Vision. 01:40:27
Themes under the plan and visit. 01:40:28
Providing recreational for local communities and a regional tourism destination. 01:40:32
The Board of Zoning Appeals hereby grants the petitioners special exception at the meeting held on the 26th of March, 2026. 01:40:37
Approval of the board is subject to. 01:40:44
To the completion of the funding conditions #1. 01:40:46
Property boundaries are to be marked. 01:40:50
To the specifications. 01:40:52
Indicate specification of Indiana Code 35-403-2-2. 01:40:54
With purple painting trees. 01:40:59
At 3:00 to 5:00 feet height and not more than 100 feet from the nearest. 01:41:01
Marked other. 01:41:06
Nourished other marked. 01:41:07
The property line is to be marked by the beginning. 01:41:09
Of the shooting. 01:41:14
Preserves licensed game bird hunting period by September the 1st. 01:41:15
#2 Hunting or archery shots fall to occur within the 50 yards of any property line. 01:41:21
No hunting. 01:41:26
Or archery shotfall to occur within the 50 yards. 01:41:27
Of any property line or public roadway. 01:41:30
Accept a continued. 01:41:34
300 buffer for the Riley residents where hunting shot. 01:41:36
Well, is not permitted, but where archery would be allowed. 01:41:39
For the attached boundary plan. 01:41:43
Shotfall areas are being defined as the area to the side or behind the target. 01:41:46
Where shots may be reasonably expected to land. 01:41:51
But not. 01:41:54
To restrict shots that may fall short of a target. 01:41:55
#3 No. 01:41:59
No trails firing. 01:42:00
Of weapons or commercial activities such as, but not limited to, parking, camping, or porta potties. 01:42:02
Are permitted within the five yards. 01:42:09
Of the property line. 01:42:11
When adjacent to the rally. 01:42:12
Riley property line. 01:42:14
From the existing tree Latin buffer to the parline easement. 01:42:17
A row of non evasive Evergreen trees at a height of 6 feet, placed every 12 feet. 01:42:25
Of the contiguous boundary. 01:42:32
#4 Archery station should follow. 01:42:34
The recommendations of the most recent archery trade. 01:42:37
Association archery range guide for community parks. 01:42:41
As. 01:42:45
By Indiana DNR rules. 01:42:46
Safety listed. 01:42:48
Safety must be posted. 01:42:50
At the shooting stations. 01:42:53
#5 existing. 01:42:55
Events exceeding 500 will require certified traffic control for the duration of the event. 01:42:58
Events with 500 fear would. 01:43:03
Will implement traffic control as required by Indiana dot. 01:43:05
Number six. 01:43:10
Camping chant RRV is allowed. 01:43:11
For the same dates of the temporary use permit, the applicant is required to contract. 01:43:14
The health department prior to issues. 01:43:19
To gain guidance and to and. 01:43:21
Any required permitting for overnight stays? 01:43:24
Camping is permitted in an area outside the commercial buffer as long as it is a safe location. 01:43:27
Camping location. 01:43:33
Shelby Camp. 01:43:35
Camping location shall be designed at the. 01:43:36
Designated at the time of the temporary use permit application. 01:43:39
#7 operating hours for hunting and archery activities. 01:43:43
Is to follow migratory bird. 01:43:46
And waterfowl. 01:43:48
Hunting hours of 1/2 hour. 01:43:49
Before sunrise to sunset, operating hours for the shooting. 01:43:52
Station is Tuesday to Saturday 9. 01:43:56
AM to half hour before sunset. 01:43:59
And Sunday noon, the half hour before sunset. 01:44:02
#8 The four required pH testing for soil samplings. 01:44:05
Must occur in accordance with the specification list in Appendix C of the Environmental Stewardship Plan. 01:44:09
The four required testings must be at least 45 days apart. 01:44:14
And performed by an independent third party. 01:44:17
Testing results will be provided. 01:44:20
As an annual report by the March 1st of each year. 01:44:23
To the Floyd County Planner, with copies to the Floyd County Stormwater Director. 01:44:26
And to the local provider. 01:44:30
Ask concerned party, local water provider as a concerned parties. 01:44:33
The report shall contain a. 01:44:37
With the locations of where the samples were taken, this report should include the number of rounds fired. 01:44:39
For the last year. 01:44:45
The Edwardsville Water Company. 01:44:47
Water quality report. 01:44:49
Is to be. 01:44:51
Included in the annual report. 01:44:52
And the requirements for lead reclamation will be triggered by the following events. 01:44:55
A 10 years from the last LED reclamation. 01:45:01
Our 10 million rounds. 01:45:04
Whichever occurs first, or. 01:45:06
If the test. 01:45:12
PH levels fall outside of the 6.5 to 8.5 per EPA management practice for lead. 01:45:14
At the outdoor shooting ranges. 01:45:21
Ideal range for three consecutive testing. 01:45:23
Soil testings #10 Do the site being in a flood way, care must be given to prevent excessive erosion as it is required to maintain 01:45:26
vegetation stabilization and shotfall area. 01:45:32
And maintain overlapping shotfull. 01:45:39
Containment. 01:45:41
#11 The applicant will submit an updated plan to the. 01:45:43
Planning staff within 90 days of any amendment. 01:45:47
To the conditions which impacts environmental stewardship, including this request. 01:45:51
That completes my ballot. 01:45:56
All right, we have a ballot. I need a second. 01:46:00
Set. Oh, I'm sorry. 01:46:03
I have a ballot in a second. 01:46:06
2nd. 01:46:07
All right. Any discussion? 01:46:09
I do have some discussion. 01:46:12
OK. 01:46:14
Just as a point of clarification. 01:46:16
From my understanding for Staffs understanding. 01:46:19
The glow shooting events are permitted as requested in this. 01:46:22
Or are they restricted as? 01:46:27
Normal operating hours. 01:46:31
I didn't address that at all. My my understanding though was that. 01:46:34
It was. 01:46:40
Not. 01:46:41
Modify the request was. 01:46:42
Not put a condition on it to restrict it. 01:46:44
So their request, their application would be being approved. I just wanted that clarification because you didn't put an additional 01:46:48
condition on the. 01:46:51
Which is fine, I just wanted that clarification and staff has no recommendation. 01:46:55
Staff was OK with the request made. 01:47:00
You're OK with the request made so that? 01:47:02
I don't have to address it then. 01:47:04
If you wanna put a condition that says. 01:47:06
The glow, uh, clay shooting as requested is approved. I think that's fine for clarification if you want to. 01:47:09
It was in the application. 01:47:15
And so you are approving what they're requesting. 01:47:18
With the conditions you've listed. 01:47:21
Yeah, additionally. 01:47:23
Staff proposed. 01:47:27
Allowing. 01:47:29
Environmental Expert. 01:47:30
To weigh in. 01:47:32
On the lead reclamation standard in their. 01:47:34
As as kind of a valve of whether it was truly necessary or not after the 10 years or 10,000 or 10 million shots or pH testings. 01:47:38
So I would ask that that. 01:47:47
Remain in there so that we're being led by science and not just the numbers. 01:47:48
I may have misheard it, yeah. 01:47:56
Yeah, just what you need to correct the first one. 01:47:58
I'm trying. Yeah, let me let him correct the first one. 01:48:02
OK. 01:48:16
What number was that in the staff report on the environmental? 01:48:18
Going back to the lead, correct, this is in regards to the lead reclamation, OK. 01:48:21
Yeah, what do you want? What do you say in the staff? 01:48:25
Right now it says you'll do. 01:48:30
10 years, 10 million rounds. 01:48:32
Or if you get outside the pH. 01:48:35
Here's the other part of the staff report. Required lead reclamation can be delayed if staff approved credential. 01:48:37
Is that what terrific I was just? 01:48:43
Wanting to add that. 01:48:45
If you would consider that. 01:48:47
I considered it when I I I mean I'll leave it up to the. 01:48:49
To see what some of my other board members think. 01:48:53
Very well, but. 01:48:55
I I left it out intentionally. 01:48:56
I'm good. 01:49:02
OK, good. 01:49:03
So the only thing I wanted. 01:49:06
I had one more. I had a. 01:49:08
We have a map. 01:49:09
And I want to mark on this map where you're talking about the tree buffer. 01:49:10
Wait, it goes. It goes from. 01:49:15
Right there. 01:49:17
Yes, Sir, where the existing tree canopy is behind the rally property, I'm going to put a. 01:49:18
Line right here, is that good? OK. 01:49:23
There's a pleasure goes around till you get to the easement. 01:49:26
So the utility wall. 01:49:30
Which is absolutely right here. 01:49:32
Wherever that. 01:49:34
Right here. 01:49:35
OK. 01:49:37
And man. 01:49:38
No, no, I would request you just because that's a double sided if you can X out in the back and I'm happy to do it on the backside 01:49:42
of that map so we're not attaching something extra. Oh yeah, there you go. Perfect. 01:49:47
Then let you mark it. 01:49:53
OK. 01:50:23
Got you. 01:50:27
All right, OK, so. 01:50:28
No, not at this point in time. We're on a ballot. 01:50:32
Okay. At this time we had an an amendment. 01:50:35
Amendment to the to the ballot. 01:50:39
I need a second on the amended ballot. 01:50:41
Any further discussion? 01:50:45
Being none, all in favor signify by aye. 01:50:47
Those opposed likewise. 01:50:50
All right. Thank you, guys. 01:50:52
Yeah, and I need, I need the second page signed along with the first page sign. Just put your initial, if you can initial the 01:50:55
bottom of each page of the ballot that does have a signature on it, correct? 01:51:01
We can do a motion to adjourn. 01:51:08
And I need a motion to adjourn. 01:51:10
I'll make a motion. I need a second. 01:51:12
I'll second got a second. All in favor signify by aye, thank you. 01:51:14

Transcript

Event transcript
Yeah, nothing's big too. 00:00:30
That's a big sucker. He's not happy. 00:00:33
Good evening. My name is Nate Creevy. I'm the director of Floyd County Plant Commission. 00:01:07
We are here for a special meeting of the BZA. 00:01:12
Before we get started, I would like to make an administrative announcement. 00:01:16
That Mister Scott Whalen has resigned from the board. 00:01:21
Mr. Guy Heidkemper has requested to be recused from. 00:01:26
The agenda item? 00:01:32
SO is under consideration for tonight. 00:01:33
The county commissioners have appointed Mr. Adam Roberts. 00:01:36
As an alternate. 00:01:40
For him. 00:01:42
And Mr. Bill White is absent for tonight. 00:01:44
With that said, we can begin the meeting and I'll call Roll. 00:01:47
I can do it from here, Mr. Larry Bieblehauser. 00:01:51
Here, Mr. Victor Andrew here. 00:01:54
Mr. Adam Roberts here. 00:01:56
Mr. Scott Whelan has resigned. Mr. Bill White is absent. 00:01:58
Thank you. 00:02:03
Thank you, Nick. The next thing we will need to take care of as the. 00:02:04
Chair and Vice Chair are not here this evening. We will need a motion to appoint a chair to run the meeting this evening. 00:02:07
I'll make a motion. 00:02:14
To appoint Mr. Unruh chair to run the meeting this evening. 00:02:15
OK, we have a motion for Mr. Unruh to serve as chair this evening. Do we have a 2nd? I'll second that. 00:02:18
All in favor. 00:02:22
Aye, any opposed? 00:02:23
Mr. Chairman, All right, let's go. All right. 00:02:26
Alrighty, this is the special meeting in Floyd County Board of Zoning Appeals. 00:02:29
Held on March 26th at 5:00 PM. 00:02:34
We went through roll call. 00:02:37
Yep, I got it. Sorry. 00:02:40
We've been through. 00:02:43
No old business. 00:02:45
At this point I turn it over to. 00:02:47
Frank, he returned over to me to go over that. Christy. Christy wants to go through the rules and procedures, of course. So just 00:02:50
brief overview. We do have them on the board behind us, but for those of you that have not been at one of our meetings before. 00:02:57
We do have sort of a formal process to allow for everything to be heard by the board. 00:03:04
And to allow for there to be. 00:03:09
Civil civility in the room so that we can proceed through the process that we need to proceed through. So we would request that 00:03:13
everybody in the room. 00:03:16
Make sure to silence cell phones and keep your comments. 00:03:20
To a minimum or. 00:03:24
When you're at the microphone only. Otherwise, please step out in the hallway if you wish to communicate with someone else so that 00:03:26
the board can hear what's going on in the room. 00:03:30
With that said, we do go through a process of. 00:03:34
The Chairman President will read the docket item on the agenda. 00:03:38
The director and staff will go through their staff recommendations and their staff report. 00:03:42
As well as any notice compliance requirements that are necessary. 00:03:47
The petitioner applicant will then have 10 minutes to present the application request. 00:03:50
The board can choose to expand the time periods. 00:03:55
That are set out. 00:03:59
If they choose to do so for good cause. 00:04:00
The board members may ask questions of the applicant. That's their opportunity to ask the applicant any questions about what's 00:04:03
being presented. 00:04:06
Next will come public comments. Those public comments are directed to the board. 00:04:10
About concerns, whether you're in favor or in opposition for you to voice those opinions to the board, it's not for you to. 00:04:14
Direct your comments to other people in the audience or to. 00:04:21
Communicate with the other side for any reason it is to direct to the board and again those are 10 minute periods each 10 minutes 00:04:25
for those in favor. 00:04:29
10 minutes for those in opposition. 00:04:33
That is 10 minutes for the total. Again, the board may choose to expand that at some point during the meeting, but that is not 10 00:04:35
minutes per person that chooses to speak. It is 10 minutes for the entire. 00:04:40
Section of those in favorable and those in opposition. 00:04:45
After that, the petitioner has the applicant. Petitioner has an opportunity to come back up for rebuttal to address any comments 00:04:49
they feel are necessary from those in favor and those in opposition. Thereafter, the Board will discuss the case, ask any 00:04:55
questions that they may deem appropriate of the applicant or staff, and then ultimately A ballot will be called for and 00:05:00
potentially voted on this evening. 00:05:05
Any questions? 00:05:12
At this time, Frank, if you come forward. 00:05:14
Good afternoon. 00:05:28
Franklin, Malden County Planner. 00:05:31
I've got docket number FC 022608. 00:05:33
Petitioners Sporting Club at the farm located at 4939 Highway 111. 00:05:38
New Albany, IN. 00:05:42
The request is for a special exception to amend conditions from special exception request. 00:05:44
This is in the agricultural residential zoning district. 00:05:48
Applicant is requesting amendments to existing conditions of approval to adjust shooting boundaries, adjust headcount limitation. 00:05:52
Alter shooting hours and alter-led reclamation operations. 00:05:58
As a. 00:06:02
History of the previous. 00:06:04
Dockets, June 10th, 2019. Docket FC 4/19/13. 00:06:05
Special exception request for a wildlife preserve in Sportsman Club. 00:06:10
March 10th, 2020 Docket. 00:06:14
FC 41913 Modification of original docket to allow events with alcohol. 00:06:16
September 13th I've got a typo in there for 15th. September 13th, 2021 Docket FC 82121 Modifications of original docket to adjust 00:06:21
hours of operation. 00:06:26
For special events, shooting courses. 00:06:31
Boundaries and to allow overnight camping. 00:06:33
And then November 25th, 2025, Docket FC-92527 Petition for revocation, which was denied but with required actions. 00:06:36
So the base conditions for this. 00:06:45
Uh, with approval for Docket FC 4/19/13. 00:06:48
One received the construction and a floodway permit from the Indiana Department of Natural Resources, if required. 00:06:51
Two shooting ranges must follow the most recent NRA Range Sourcebook guidelines, including noise dampening measures with a maximum 00:06:56
decibel reading of 75 decibels at property line or public roadways. 00:07:01
Three, the range must follow the EPA's Best Management Practices for Leaded Outdoor Shooting ranges and the Environmental 00:07:06
Stewardship Plan included in the application. 00:07:10
Forward developments stormwater prevention plan with Floyd County stormwater department with emphasis on. 00:07:14
Lead contamination. 00:07:20
Five hours of operation for use of the range. 00:07:22
So a summer. 00:07:25
Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 AM to 7:00 PM. Sunday, noon to 7:00 PM Be Winter Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 AM to 5:00 PM. 00:07:27
Sunday, noon to 5:00 PM. 00:07:31
With a note that summer. 00:07:35
Begins with daylight savings times changes. 00:07:37
Amended March 10th. 00:07:39
By Docket FC 4/19/13 to add hours of events are Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 AM to 11:30 PM. 00:07:42
This is amended 9/14/2021 by Docket. 00:07:49
FC 8/21/21 to add that special shooting tournaments events. 00:07:52
8:00 AM to sunset and E. 00:07:56
Gun shooting events that require an early start time are limited to five events per year and not more than one per month. 00:07:59
Each special event requires. 00:08:04
The issuance of a temporary use permit through the Floyd County Building and Development Office. 00:08:06
With each temporary use. 00:08:11
Permit The applicant is required to place signage announcing each event no less than 30 days prior and mailing a notice. 00:08:13
One property owner deep 2 property owners informing them of the dates of the event once the event is finalized and not less than 00:08:18
30 days prior to the event. 00:08:21
6 Development plan with requirements per Section 9.05 The Floyd County Zoning Ordinance submitted with review and approval by 00:08:27
staff. 00:08:31
7 The Floyd County Board of Zoning Appeals with the assistance of staff. 00:08:34
Shall review for compliance with all requirements one year from data. 00:08:37
Full operation 8. 00:08:40
No shooting within 300 yards of any property line or public roadway. 00:08:42
This was amended 9/15/2021 by Docket. 00:08:45
FC 8/21/21 to add amended to exhibit boundaries. Shooting station located at an elevation. 00:08:49
10 feet below berm. The boundary expansion is allowed with the following requirement. 00:08:54
All stations are pointed inward toward the property interior and the outer shooting stations to have posted. 00:08:59
Rules prohibiting loading of weapons until the participant is securely in the shooting station prior to firing. 00:09:04
9 No rifles or pistols, only birdshot. 00:09:09
10 amended with docket FC 4/19/13 to remove the condition that. 00:09:12
The remainder of the farm outside the limits of the 24 station shooting course shown on the. 00:09:17
Plan is restricted to farm use only. 00:09:21
11 Applicant must obtain requirement permits from the Floyd County Health Department. 00:09:23
12 At minimum, every two years in the dry season, shooting associated materials and lead shall be reclaimed from shotfall area. 00:09:27
13 Contact LG and E regarding shooting in the area toward power lines on property. 14 Amended with Docket 4 or FC-41913 to alter. 00:09:34
The line. 00:09:43
No alcoholic beverages will be permitted on the site is removed. 00:09:44
Alcoholic beverages. 00:09:47
Or and instead it's alcoholic beverages will not be permitted within 200 yards of range Area alcohol to be catered by a licensed 00:09:48
vendor only no other alcoholic. 00:09:52
Beverages permitted at any other time. 00:09:57
Once alcohol is served, the range and hunting areas will be closed. 15 The applicant will work to buffer sound for Mr. Riley's 00:09:59
property. 00:10:02
This was amended 9/14/2021 by Docket FC 8/21/21 to add. 00:10:05
Increase the buffer for the Riley property with a denser planting minimum of 25 and taller trees minimum of 10 feet. 00:10:09
Approved by staff. 00:10:15
Consider the location of the shooting station when placing trees. 00:10:16
16 Amended by Docket FC 4/19/13 to alter. 00:10:20
There's a strikeout through the line upland. Game hunting is restricted to unforced areas and other restrictions on shooting of 00:10:24
guns. 00:10:27
And is replaced with maximum people at events 500 per day if more than 300. 00:10:31
Must have. 00:10:35
Traffic control. 00:10:36
This was amended with Docket FC 8/21/21 to add. 00:10:38
Camping tinter RV is allowed for the same dates as the temporary use permits the applicant. 00:10:41
Is required to contact the health department prior to issuance to guide. 00:10:45
Or to gain guidance and any required. 00:10:48
Permitting for overnight stays camping is permitted in any area as long as it's a safe location. Camping location to be designated 00:10:51
at the time of the temporary use permit application. 00:10:55
And then for the petition of revocation. 00:11:01
Required actions were. 00:11:04
Were made for FC-925271 owner meeting with two board members and staff. This has been met 2 Enforcement of staff's recommendations 00:11:06
as stipulated in the staff report, the aforementioned recommendation state. 00:11:12
For the restricted boundary areas restriction, a survey should be conducted and farm staff shall post markings signs dedicated 00:11:19
along the restricted area. 00:11:23
Every 50 feet or so I do not have. 00:11:27
Proof that this has been met yet? 00:11:29
Next for maximum attendees restrictions. 00:11:31
Moderate event capacity by both spectators and participants via sign in sheet or other event attendance tracking. 00:11:34
For the traffic restriction, ensure traffic control. 00:11:41
Contractors are operating for duration of events. 00:11:43
And then Item 3, no archery events until corrections are made for a Marshall shall be present at all archery events. Five payment 00:11:46
of fines in the amount of $3000 which has been paid. 00:11:51
So the applicant requests the following alterations request #1 Alteration of approved shooting boundary to allow archery and 00:11:57
upland hunts close to the property line. 00:12:01
This would amend a couple of those conditions. So #8 proposed amendment. 00:12:05
By Docket FC2268. 00:12:09
To remove the no shooting with. 00:12:12
Been 300 yards of any property line or public roadway and instead replace that with the. 00:12:14
No shooting within 30 feet of any property line or public roadway. Accepting a continued 300 yard buffer from the Riley residence. 00:12:18
Where archery would be allowed within 50 yards of said Riley property line per the attached boundary plan. 00:12:24
This would still include that prior amendment. 00:12:30
With that was amended back with 9/15/2021. 00:12:33
Item 15. The applicant will work to buffer sound from Mr. Riley's property, the proposed amendment. 00:12:38
With Docket FC2268. 00:12:43
Is to add enhanced visual screening. 00:12:46
And supplement sound diffusion by purchasing and planting additional fast growing trees to be installed, particularly along the. 00:12:49
Riley property line. 00:12:54
As my own personal note, item 2 shooting ranges must follow the. 00:12:56
Most recent NRA range source guidelines. 00:13:01
Including that 5075 decibels at property line or public roadways. 00:13:04
This is for shooting ranges, not for the upland hunting activities. 00:13:08
Request #2 Alteration of the fixed headcount limitation and replace it with the traffic control standard. 00:13:13
This amends. 00:13:18
Condition 16. Proposed amendment by Docket FC2268. 00:13:19
Events exceeding 500 attendees will require certified traffic control for the duration of the event and. 00:13:24
Striking out the maximum people at events 500 per day if more than 300 must have traffic control. 00:13:29
Request #3 Alteration of the current shooting and event hours for DNR hunting hours. 00:13:35
So the proposed amendment. 00:13:40
To condition #5 would change the hours of operation. 00:13:43
For the range to remove the Tuesday through Saturday and Sunday. 00:13:47
Specifics to match DNR hunting hours. 00:13:51
And then B allow shooting until half hour prior to dusk from March until end of August. 00:13:54
And then would strike out the. 00:13:59
Daylight savings times and then we strike out the hours of events Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 to 11:30. 00:14:01
An additional. 00:14:06
A proposed amendment there would be. 00:14:08
Item F Glow Clay shooting events permitted on Friday afternoons evenings from November through February. Limited to 4 per month. 00:14:11
With glow-clay events ending at 10. 00:14:17
Shoot locations to be located at existing 5 stand locations opposite of the Riley property. 00:14:19
And request #4 alteration of the current lead reclamation operations. 00:14:24
This would amend condition #3 the rain. 00:14:28
Which would add increased pH testing from 2 times per year to four times per year. 00:14:32
Maintain that. 00:14:37
Vegetative stabilization in shopfall areas and maintain overlapping shopfall containment zones. 00:14:38
We would also amend. 00:14:43
Condition #12 proposed amendment. 00:14:44
Strikeout at minimum every two years in the dry season. Shooting associated. 00:14:47
Materials and lead shall be reclaimed from shopfall areas. 00:14:51
And then replace that with lead reclamation to occur every ten years or based on a professional evaluation, the pH testing 00:14:54
results. 00:14:57
Just a moment. 00:15:01
Thank you. 00:15:09
So for staff comments, the special exception will not be injurious to the public health, safety, morals and general welfare of the 00:15:11
community. 00:15:14
Request number one to alter the boundary for hunting and archery are found to not be injurious in areas where the rugged. 00:15:17
Nature of the surrounding landscape and wooded buffers offer protection for neighboring properties and where archery and hunting 00:15:22
activities are not aimed towards these neighboring properties. 00:15:26
Additionally, hunting activities are found to be less frequent and in less intensity than. 00:15:29
Then the shooting stations. 00:15:33
Which are still limited in their location so long as hunters are clearly aware of the property lines. 00:15:35
Request #2 to amend traffic standards. 00:15:40
May want additional clarification from in dot which. 00:15:42
I received a an e-mail correspondence from. 00:15:46
In dot yesterday afternoon, which I'll. 00:15:49
This is stating that they did not have issues. 00:15:59
With. 00:16:02
Changes to the. 00:16:03
Number of people on the on the site. 00:16:06
Request #3 for alterations to hours are to be limited to daytime hours or DNR hunting standards. 00:16:08
Request #4 for an alteration of the lead. Mitigation efforts are to be accompanied by a better soil monitoring system and 00:16:14
alternative triggers. 00:16:17
For lead reclamation. 00:16:21
2 The use and value of the area adjacent to the property is. 00:16:22
Subject to the special exception, will not be affected in a substantially adverse manner. 00:16:25
The site currently allows for agricultural uses by rights such as logging operations, which have more of a noise impact than 00:16:30
changes proposed. 00:16:33
Most of the site is buffered by substantial wooded areas, natural terrain and the end of dispersion of the proposed activities. 00:16:36
Limits to disruption are provided through time restrictions, provisions of buffers to open. 00:16:41
Residential areas, directions in which shots are allowed to be fired and landscaping provisions. 00:16:47
Three, the need for the special exception does arise from some condition peculiar to the property involved. 00:16:52
The site encompasses over 500 acres with highly irregular topography, extensive wooded buffers. 00:16:57
Elevation changes and multiple natural barriers. 00:17:03
That are unique to the site. 00:17:05
Much of the topography is not buildable due to flooding or elevation, limiting the typical uses of the parcel. 00:17:07
For the strict application of the terms of the Floyd County zoning ordinance will result in an unnecessary hardship in the use of 00:17:12
the property. 00:17:15
This use is not specified in the zoning ordinance requiring a special exception. 00:17:19
The applicant argues. 00:17:23
That the amendments to the original condition. 00:17:24
Are based on a development, Sorry. 00:17:27
Based on a developed experience in managing of this type of use and that many of the original conditions did not reflect the 00:17:29
actual safety conditions, terrain or operational capacities of the site. 00:17:34
And five, the approval of the special exception will not contradict the goals and objectives of the Floyd County Comprehensive 00:17:39
Plan. The 2017 Vision Floyd County Comprehensive Plan details community preferences on page 23. 00:17:45
Which lists a preference for more recreational and park activities at 74% and more entertainment and cultural activities or 00:17:51
cultural events at 65%. 00:17:55
Further, a sporting club fits with the key community vision themes under play and visit, providing recreation for the local 00:17:59
community and a regional tourism desk. 00:18:02
Uh, destination. 00:18:06
So for staff recommendations. 00:18:11
With request #1 Alteration of approved shooting boundary to allow archery and upland hunts closer to the property line. 00:18:13
Staff finds that if this were non commercial, the proposed activities of archery and hunting would be permitted up to the property 00:18:19
line. Staff finds that the 300 yard buffer to be too limiting, but finds a 10 yard buffer is not adequate. 00:18:24
So that finds that the hunting shots fired do not occur at the same frequency as rain shots and thus should not have the same 00:18:30
level of disturbance. However, the intensity of activities is increased due to the commercial nature of this property. 00:18:35
Including trails, camping and parking for events. Justifying at least the partial use of commercial buffers along the property 00:18:40
line of a lower intensity use to protect residents. 00:18:44
Further, Section 5.20 of the Floyd County ordinance. 00:18:48
Requires no parking within a commercial buffer yard. 00:18:51
The natural buffers and rugged terrain that protect most of the neighbors is not president. 00:18:54
Sorry, is not present. 00:18:58
For portions of the Riley property and so a greater buffer is warranted for firearms. 00:19:02
Neighboring residents have expressed safety concerns over proximity of shots and have reported multiple arrows landing within 00:19:06
their property along the previous archery events and hunters facing towards their property. 00:19:11
The Archery Range Guide for Community Parks, written by Archery Trade Association, by the Archery Trade Association and utilized 00:19:16
by Indiana Department of Natural Resources. 00:19:19
Recommends ordinances to prevent hunting within 150 feet or 50 yards of residential property lines and public right of ways, and 00:19:23
further recommends that any shots fired within 150 yards should be faced towards the interior of the property. 00:19:29
The Archery Range Guide further provides best practices for target safety, such as a buffer beyond the target or provision of a. 00:19:35
Fence or berm? 00:19:41
And recommends firing those at an angle no greater than parallel to the ground and encourages placing targets below shooting 00:19:42
positions. Additionally, as unguided hunts are offered and hunters may be unfamiliar with the property, borders and safety 00:19:47
concerns are expressed over archery stations in proximity to neighbors. 00:19:51
The following conditions are recommended. 00:19:56
Property boundaries are to be marked to the specification of IC 354322. 00:19:59
Also known as the purple paint law as an example, with purple painted trees at 3 to 5 feet high and not more than 100 feet from 00:20:04
the nearest other marked tree. 00:20:08
The property line is to be marked by the beginning of the shooting. Preserve licensed game bird hunting period. 00:20:13
Which is by September 1st, 2026. 00:20:18
No hunting or archery shotfall to occur within 50 yards of any property line or public roadway. Accepting a continued 300 yard 00:20:21
buffer for the Riley residence. 00:20:24
Where hunting shotfall is not permitted, but where archery would still be allowed. 00:20:28
For the attached boundary plan. 00:20:32
Shot fall area here being defined as the area to the side or behind a target where shots may be reasonably expected to land. 00:20:33
But not to restrict shots that may fall short of the. 00:20:40
Of a target. 00:20:42
As a note, the former change to buffer area to remain as amended on 9/15/21. 00:20:44
By Docket FC, 8/21/21. 00:20:49
No trails, firing of weapons, or commercial activity such as, but not limited to parking, RV campgrounds or porta pots within 5 00:20:52
yards of property line. 00:20:56
This buffer shall have at least one deciduous canopy tree for only 15 feet of contiguous boundary and or a row of Evergreen trees 00:21:01
and a height of. 00:21:04
At a height of 6 feet, placed every 12 feet when adjacent to neighboring parcels. 00:21:07
Archery stations should follow the recommendations of the most recent Archery Trade Associations Archery Range Guide for community 00:21:12
parks as utilized by Indiana DNR. 00:21:16
Rules for safety, which are listed on page 11 of this edition, must be posted at Shooting. 00:21:20
Shooting stations. 00:21:25
And as clarity for that. 00:21:26
This can be like paper staple to a post. 00:21:28
Request #2. 00:21:31
Alteration of the fixed headcount limitation and replace it with a traffic control standard. Staff supports lifting the 500 guests 00:21:32
maximum requirement, but the following condition is recommended. 00:21:37
For events exceeding 500 attendees. 00:21:42
Will require certified traffic control for the duration of the event. 00:21:45
Events with 500 or fewer attendees will implement traffic control as required by INDOT, but we have a. 00:21:50
An e-mail to update. 00:21:55
From that. 00:21:56
Request #3 Alteration of the current shooting at event hours to DNR hunting hours. 00:21:58
Clarification is needed as DNR does not have one set of hunting times for all game, while pheasant and chukar fall under the small 00:22:03
game hunting hours which are not restricted by DNR. 00:22:07
Staff does not recommend allowing hunting activities after nightfall. 00:22:12
So sunset in Floyd County is roughly 5:30 PM in early December to 9:00 PM in late July. 00:22:15
The level of disturbance caused by hunting and archery is different than that of the shooting stations. Therefore, staff 00:22:20
recommends the following conditions. 00:22:23
Operating hours for hunting and archery activities is to follow migratory birds and waterfowl hunting hours of half hour before 00:22:27
sunrise to sunset. 00:22:30
Operating hours for the shooting stations is Tuesday through Saturday, 9:00 AM to half hour before sunset. 00:22:35
Sunday noon to half hour before sunset. 00:22:39
Request #4 Alteration of the current lead reclamation operations. 00:22:42
Hey, Frank, could you stop me just a second? Give me a rest. 00:22:46
We failed to ask the applicant. 00:22:50
We do not have a full board. 00:22:53
So it's it's at your. 00:22:55
Option to either. 00:22:59
Table this or whatever without a full board so. 00:23:01
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. If you can come up, that'd be great. 00:23:04
We just want to get confirmation if you're OK with us proceeding without a full board. 00:23:07
I didn't want you to keep reading if they did. 00:23:12
Mark Phillips and and Joe Craig, we've talked about it since we talked to Christy about it. 00:23:16
Talk to Nick about it. 00:23:20
And we have no objection understanding that. 00:23:21
Whatever decision you make has to be unanimous, whatever that is. 00:23:24
And so let me just confirm a JoJo. 00:23:27
Yes, representing accurately your position. 00:23:30
Yes, understanding whatever the determination is, you can't come back later and say, oh, no, didn't agree. Yeah. 00:23:33
We're good. Thank you. Go ahead, Frank. I'm sorry. 00:23:37
I don't normally. 00:23:41
Chair this board. So I forgot to thanks for the thanks for the break. You need a break anyway. 00:23:42
So request #4 alteration of the current lead reclamation operations. 00:23:50
The EPA's best management practices for lead at Outdoor shooting ranges indicates in Chapter 3, page 3-16, that for shotgun ranges 00:23:54
there is a wide range in reclamation standards. 00:23:59
One source indicates reclamation should occur when a range has thrown 250,000 to 1,000,000 targets. 00:24:04
While another source indicates reclamation should occur if at least 2 lbs of lead per square foot have accumulated on the range. 00:24:09
Averaging about 1 oz. 00:24:14
Of lead per shot and considering approximately 50 acres in the shooting range. Shotfull area for the farm. 00:24:16
This would be roughly 69,696,000 shots fired. 00:24:22
In the same section, the guide states that the NRA recommends a frequency of one to five years for lead cleanup, even on ranges 00:24:26
with minimal use. This is quoted from Metallic Bullets, Lead Deposits on outdoor and indoor firing ranges from 1991. 00:24:31
In the report prepared by Doctor Richard Petticoard submitted to staff in March of 2024, it is indicated that lead reclamation at. 00:24:37
Small to moderate size clay target. 00:24:45
Ranges as occurring at intervals of perhaps five to seven years. 00:24:47
But much more commonly 8 to 10 year or longer intervals, with many in the mid to upper teens of years between reclamation 00:24:50
activities. 00:24:53
As this is in the AE flood way, care must also be given to prevent excess erosion caused due to the vegetation removal necessary 00:24:57
for shot reclamation. 00:25:00
The IDEM technical Guidance document for leaded outdoor small arms firing ranges on page 2 indicates that drinking water is seldom 00:25:06
affected by firing ranges because of the low solubility and restricted migration of metallic lead. 00:25:11
To further address concerns of lead in groundwater, though. 00:25:17
Soil acidity should be kept in the ideal range of 6.5 to 8.5 on the pH scale as listed in the Best management practices. 00:25:19
Chapter 2, page 21 and 2. 00:25:26
While the ITRC guide. 00:25:29
For environmental management. 00:25:30
Operating Outdoor Small Arms Firing ranges, pages 8 and 9 indicates rain and the acidity of the rain as potential causes for lead 00:25:32
mobility. 00:25:36
It also indicates that organic materials and clay absorb lead and remove it from the water. 00:25:40
The soil for this property, according to the soils layer and beacon derived from the soil survey geographic database, shows the 00:25:44
shotfall areas, a mix of silt looms. 00:25:48
Software rec. 00:25:52
Soft bedrock substratum. 00:25:53
And primarily silty clay loam as indicated by. 00:25:55
Womack whoa, sorry WM AK in that set layer. 00:25:58
Given the prevalence of clay on the site and that the area is vegetated. 00:26:03
That soil is being tested for acidity and that item indicates drinking water is seldom affected. 00:26:06
There are multiple protections to keep lead from migrating off site. 00:26:11
Staff finds that clarification is needed for when a professional evaluation should be triggered though. 00:26:14
And to forbid clustering of test results, the following conditions are recommended. 00:26:18
The four required pH testings for soil sampling must occur to the specifications listed in Appendix C of the Environmental 00:26:24
Stewardship Plan at least 45 days apart and the tests done by an independent third party. 00:26:29
The testing results should be provided as an annual report by March 1st of each year. 00:26:35
To the Floyd County Planner, with copies provided to the Floyd County Stormwater Director. 00:26:39
And to the local law. 00:26:43
Sorry, and to the local water provider as concerned parties. 00:26:44
This report should also include an approximate number of rounds fired for that year. 00:26:48
A requirement for lead reclamation is to be triggered by the following events. 00:26:52
10 years from the last row. 00:26:56
From the last lead reclamation. 00:26:57
Every 10 million shots. 00:26:59
Or if the tested pH level. 00:27:01
Falls outside of the 6.5 to 8.5 ideal range for three consecutive soil testings. 00:27:03
A required lead reclamation can be delayed if a staff approved credentialed expert submits a professional evaluation indicating 00:27:08
when the next lead reclamation should occur. 00:27:12
Applicant will send an updated plan to planning staff within 90 days of any amendment to conditions which impact the Environmental 00:27:17
Stewardship Plan, including this request. 00:27:21
Thank you. 00:27:26
Does anybody have any questions for Frank? 00:27:28
Larry, thank you, Frank. 00:27:32
OK, at this time would the applicant like to come forward and present their case? 00:27:36
Yeah, Joe Cray, 7209 Maplin Place Prospect, KY. 00:27:51
Yeah, Mark Phillips. 00:27:56
31 W Main St. Boonville, IN. 00:27:59
We addressed the board. 00:28:03
Let me, let me. I'm sorry. We were just talking about the possibility of expansion and dealing with that upfront. Christie's 00:28:04
recommended that we double the time that we normally do go to 20 minutes. 00:28:09
In fact, we don't intend to use the full 10 minutes, OK. So, so anyway, I'm sure that you guys would want the 20 minutes. 00:28:15
Absolutely. OK, so let's record show that. 00:28:20
That. 00:28:25
He refused 20, they accept 20 on the on the front end. But when we have the right to close, we may ask for a little bit of leeway 00:28:26
if that's necessary. OK, so so let me explain why why we don't think we need the 10 minutes. 00:28:32
We have presented to you. 00:28:39
An application. 00:28:42
To modify the conditions. 00:28:43
That in most part. 00:28:46
Mr. Walden agrees to There are just a couple things. 00:28:48
That I want to clarify. 00:28:51
One of which is. 00:28:53
And the pages aren't numbered, so I can't tell you what the number of pages, but one of the things and and I'm going to start from 00:28:56
from the end moving forward. 00:28:59
One of the things that Mister Walden identified and I'm reading from. 00:29:02
The 76 page. 00:29:07
Draft of the report we got this week. 00:29:10
And it is a. 00:29:12
It is a. 00:29:14
It is from this. 00:29:15
This is the. 00:29:17
What it looks like. 00:29:18
If that helps you. 00:29:19
But it's a document after maps and after applications and after some other things. 00:29:20
And it provides for. 00:29:26
And it's in reference to some extent, what, what Mr. when Mr. Petticord presented. But there's something if you'll go to the 00:29:28
second page. 00:29:31
Or I'm sorry, third page. 00:29:36
And I'm reading from paragraph 4. 00:29:37
This is a survey that was done. 00:29:39
Each of the three company representatives, and these were people in different areas that run shooting. 00:29:42
Facilities and and clay ranges like like the farm. 00:29:47
Each of the three company representatives summarized their knowledge of shot reclamation at smaller, moderate sized clay target 00:29:50
ranges. 00:29:53
As occurring at intervals of perhaps five to seven years, but much more commonly 8 to 10 years. 00:29:57
Or longer and that would meet Mr. Walters recommendation. 00:30:01
But they go further to say. 00:30:04
With many in the mid upper teens of years between reclamation activities. 00:30:05
Paragraph 6. Management of a sporting club at the farm contacted operators of three ranges in the state of Indiana, one in 00:30:10
northern part of the state. 00:30:13
Does not reclaim shot at all. 00:30:17
Central IN range is roughly the size of the sporting club at the farm has been in operation for 10 to 15 years. 00:30:18
And has never reclaimed shot. 00:30:23
In the third range in southern Indiana, reclaimed shot from Stratfields at approximately 20 year intervals but does not reclaim. 00:30:25
Shot from a sporting clays course and so. 00:30:30
The the 10 years probably is reasonable. 00:30:34
We have a gentleman, if you. 00:30:36
One last question to you met before. 00:30:38
And I will tell you. 00:30:41
That in the packet of information. 00:30:42
Farther back than that. 00:30:45
There is a section. 00:30:46
Two page section of questions submitted to Argent. 00:30:48
Argent's here. 00:30:51
And having read that, he recommends that the final question. 00:30:52
Is if this were your own range, when would you plan the next reclamation? And he said 20 years. 00:30:57
So, and it's largely because of the concentration in the small area in which that shot falls and. 00:31:01
If you have questions, he's a better. 00:31:07
Source to answer that question than I am. 00:31:09
Secondly. 00:31:11
I want to remind the board and and. 00:31:12
You did a nice job of recapping what's occurred. 00:31:16
For those of us that were not here when this started. 00:31:18
But in 2020, after the initial restrictions were in place. 00:31:21
The Farm. 00:31:25
Which did not include Joe's involvement at that time. 00:31:26
Planet 40. 00:31:31
Spruce trees. 00:31:32
In 2023, they planted 40 more. 00:31:34
Spruce trees, and they did it in an area that was directed by the board. 00:31:36
They spent around $10,000. 00:31:40
Or more to do that. 00:31:42
And those were placed at the direction of the board where it was determined that those would be necessary for sound. 00:31:44
Purposes. 00:31:49
Had nothing to do with vision. 00:31:50
And so they complied with that request. They have complied with the request that you imposed regarding marking the property. 00:31:52
The purple paint is intended to keep trespassers off. 00:32:00
For those of us that own private property and have the fear of people trespassing, that's what we're. 00:32:03
Required to do to give them notice and then if they don't comply we can. 00:32:07
We can report them and they could possibly charge the trespassing. 00:32:10
Regardless of that, we've complied and. 00:32:14
Frank to God who is here? 00:32:16
Sir, would you please stand? 00:32:18
It's my understanding this gentleman has spoken with Nick. 00:32:21
His credentials are significant. It's my understanding you have his resume. 00:32:24
And he has been to the farm yesterday and today. 00:32:28
He has inspected the entire property. 00:32:31
He has inspected it for purposes of compliance with your rules and regulations and he can tell you better than I. 00:32:33
But those are those are in place. 00:32:39
Thirdly. 00:32:42
We're happy to see that MDOT doesn't have a change to the traffic control requirements. 00:32:43
Given given the high traffic on 111. 00:32:48
I'm not surprised. So I appreciate you getting that because that's been a bone of contention and we didn't have. 00:32:52
The ability to get that kind of a timely response, you did it and we agree. 00:32:57
We intend to have. 00:33:01
Traffic control for this event you've ordered that we intend to comply. 00:33:02
With respect to the hours of operation. 00:33:06
DNR does publish hours of operations for shooting. 00:33:11
And it's typically 1/2 hour before sunset of sunrise and 1/2 hour after sunset. 00:33:14
Now the reality of this is simple. 00:33:18
These people aren't going to put the people who are patronizing that facility. 00:33:20
And and who who pay to be safely enjoying that facility. They're not going to put them at risk. Never have and never will. 00:33:24
And so I if you're looking for a benchmark on ours. 00:33:30
That's a simple one. 00:33:34
And as Mr. Walton said when he was up here to you before I. 00:33:35
If if this was not. 00:33:39
The subject of these special exceptions. 00:33:41
It they could use this property in a fashion that they determine and no one else could control it. 00:33:43
They could. They could do things up to the property. 00:33:47
We're not here to debate that. You've made your recommendations previously. 00:33:50
We've abided by those. 00:33:53
Finally. 00:33:55
Attack event. It's here. 00:33:56
Rob Solinsky is here. 00:33:58
He is the manager of that with with the owner, Sean. They're both here. 00:34:00
If you've never been to the farm. 00:34:06
Into the farm. I would encourage you to do it. I, I, my wife's here. 00:34:08
And she and I got to write up to. 00:34:12
For the vendor villages and I'm just going to tell you. 00:34:14
If there if there are more beautiful places in Floyd County, I'm not sure what they would look like because it's absolutely 00:34:17
gorgeous. 00:34:19
Well, what's important to see on that property and that location? 00:34:22
The neighbors can't see him. 00:34:27
So we talked about all kinds of of, of, of innuendo and. 00:34:29
And make all kinds of accusations. The reality of it is this is a responsible use of that property. 00:34:34
Consistent with the rules and regulations that you've imposed. 00:34:39
And as an example. 00:34:43
For those of you who have not been there in the last 24 hours. 00:34:45
Remember, last year is at 5 Mile Lane. 00:34:48
A5 mile lane there. There was a complaint made. 00:34:51
Because there were people that had bows. 00:34:53
Or archery equipment on that. 00:34:56
Remember that complaint? 00:34:58
You go look. 00:35:00
They have a target set. 00:35:01
Towards the water if you hadn't been on the property and I think. 00:35:03
Mr. Unruh and Mr. Bieber Hauser, you have. 00:35:07
Mr. Roberts, don't know if you have or not. 00:35:09
But you know that there's water behind that target and they're shooting down. 00:35:11
Mr. Solinsky will will confirm and Mr. Degat will as well. Who's an independent person? 00:35:15
Who I understand. 00:35:21
Staff have agreed is going to be your third party observer. 00:35:23
He will validate to you that there are no shots. 00:35:27
Going near anybody's property. 00:35:30
Outside of this, outside of the. 00:35:32
So rather than me tell you those things. 00:35:34
If Joe you want to add something or. 00:35:37
If the gentleman who are here that that are not connected to the farm, you want to hear from them. 00:35:40
We would use the balance of our time for that purpose. 00:35:45
It's up to them, right? 00:35:47
Yeah, it's up to you guys if you want to introduce any of those people to come up and speak. 00:35:48
And while we're bringing up, I just want to say thank you very much. I know it seems like we're here once a month. 00:35:52
And I know that the board has the same feelings as we do, so we say thank you very much and we just want to make sure we get, you 00:35:57
know, a shot to show you what we can do and abide by the rules. So appreciate that. Thank you. 00:36:03
Just state your name and address for the record if you will. 00:36:13
Brock Zielinski, 4019 Chieftain Rd. Irwin, PA. 00:36:15
15642. 00:36:19
OK. 00:36:20
I'm a representative Total Archer challenge. I'd be happy to answer any questions you guys have about our operation or any any 00:36:22
history that you know how we operate our business and. 00:36:26
I thank you, Cortana. 00:36:31
So how many of these events do you do a year? 00:36:33
So we do. 00:36:36
Right now will be 13 events this year based around the United States. 00:36:37
And as far as your safety record? 00:36:40
So we have shoot over. 00:36:43
25,000,000 arrows over the last 14 years we have over 250,000. 00:36:45
Shooters total unique people across the last 14 years. 00:36:50
We've had one injury that was. 00:36:53
Not. 00:36:56
From. 00:36:57
Negligence on total archery challenge every the last 14 years. OK. 00:36:58
Alrighty, and you're putting on the event that's. 00:37:01
Coming up. Is that correct? Yes, Sir. 00:37:04
OK, alright. 00:37:05
Larry So. 00:37:07
My understanding is you have multiple courses out on this property. 00:37:10
Yes, Sir. 00:37:14
And there will be multiple groups of people. 00:37:15
At the big one group at this one and one group of that one, so. 00:37:17
Yes, Sir. 00:37:21
Will there? What kind of monitoring do you do of the new people? 00:37:23
While they're on the course, so we release groups a Max of 16 people. 00:37:27
Every 30 minutes. 00:37:32
And we have a staff of anywhere from 2:00 to. 00:37:33
Four people on the site. 00:37:35
All the time. 00:37:38
And so the way we operate our event is that everything is accessible by machine. 00:37:39
So no ones ever shooting across the road so it's safe. So we have guys roaming the mountain. 00:37:43
Constantly to make sure they're safe. 00:37:48
And following the rules and if someone should break a rule, they are ejected from the event permanently. 00:37:49
OK. Can I ask the question? It's your time. So I asked a question earlier. Tell them about the safety course. 00:37:56
That they now have to access. 00:38:02
Pass and the condition it is before they can sign up for. 00:38:05
So every single person prior to shooting or attending one of our events has to. 00:38:08
During the registration process has to watch a safety video. 00:38:13
That walks you through. 00:38:15
All the. 00:38:17
The guides. 00:38:18
Even answering questions is for course etiquette and how to behave professionally and responsibly. 00:38:19
Prior to signing up if they show up. 00:38:23
And have not signed up or watched that video. Signed the waiver saying they have. They're not allowed to attend or shoot on the 00:38:25
event. 00:38:28
10 more thanks. Thank you. 00:38:33
Yep. 00:38:35
Nick, do you want to start another 10 minutes? Because they've only utilized 10 minutes. 00:38:37
Sorry, you're OK. 00:38:45
Frank Degas, 617 Evergreen Dr. Clarksville, IN. 00:38:50
And I've watched these. 00:38:55
Safety video they have. 00:38:57
It's one of the best ones I've ever seen. 00:38:59
And I've walked the boundaries of the targets. 00:39:03
And everyone of us facing away. 00:39:07
From the property. 00:39:10
I think the closest was about 85 yards parallel. 00:39:11
To that property line. 00:39:16
And it's shooting into a bank. 00:39:18
There's one at the far end towards Gap Hollow Rd. 00:39:21
It's far enough away, it's elevated and they're shooting down. 00:39:25
So I did not find any targets. 00:39:29
That were. 00:39:32
Unsafe. 00:39:34
Now are are you? 00:39:35
The gentleman that's been picked to be out there for to observe the event. 00:39:37
Is that OK? OK. 00:39:42
Alright, I got you. 00:39:43
All right, knock it out. 00:39:44
Link here to the video if you all want it. 00:39:45
OK, we can. 00:39:48
Yeah, you can provide that if you'd like. 00:39:50
Thank you. 00:39:55
And So what you've done is obviously before, correct, OK. 00:39:57
OK. 00:40:01
All right, so you have your experience at it then? Yes, setting up ranges and. 00:40:01
Shooting. 00:40:06
OK. 00:40:07
Alrighty, any questions anymore? 00:40:08
Ask another question? Sure, go ahead. 00:40:11
I asked you earlier, I met you for the first time today. 00:40:15
If if you observe a safety violation, what what? 00:40:19
Where Where is your loyalty? 00:40:23
It's reported immediately. 00:40:24
And if you observe an unsafe condition. 00:40:26
What, what? What were you then doing? Reported immediately or? 00:40:29
So so. 00:40:32
If you see something that you're concerned about, what whether it's a violation or not? 00:40:34
You will report it immediately. 00:40:38
Based on what you've been asked to do. 00:40:42
And then finally tell the board when you're going to be. 00:40:43
I'll be there Friday, Saturday and Sunday. 00:40:46
During the duration of the shoot. 00:40:49
So what? What? 00:40:51
What does? 00:40:52
Uh, system have you set up to be able to get ahold of whoever you need to get ahold of if you do find something? 00:40:53
And you need to report it. How do you do that? 00:40:59
My cell phone, I'll have their numbers. And who is that person you call? 00:41:03
To tack. 00:41:07
Are to the people at the farm OK? 00:41:08
OK. 00:41:11
Or repealed provided reports. 00:41:11
No, no, exactly. But do you? Do you want him to have your number too? 00:41:15
OK, OK. 00:41:20
OK. 00:41:23
We bought, we also talked about an hour ago about the reports that you're going to make to the board after the event and you're 00:41:25
familiar with that and that's been explained to you. 00:41:28
Yes, Sir. And that's a report that you will prepare based on the information you're getting. 00:41:31
Yes, Sir, nobody's going to prepare them on your behalf. 00:41:34
No, Sir. 00:41:37
Good enough for me. What about you? Anything. 00:41:39
OK. Thank you, Sir. You're welcome. 00:41:42
Yeah, yeah. 00:41:46
Arjun van Buell. 00:41:52
4546. 00:41:54
Concrete Rd. Georgia. 00:41:56
Ball Ground GA. 00:41:58
OK, alright. 00:41:59
Can you just just give us a little bit of background on yourself? 00:42:01
What you do and of course of year. 00:42:05
What your experience is just so the board can understand what you do. 00:42:07
So my background was in environmental remediation. 00:42:10
And. 00:42:14
Through that, I came in contact. 00:42:15
With cleaning up a gun range. 00:42:17
And doing that, that was really what I like to do. So I started doing that. 00:42:20
As the only thing I do and. 00:42:25
I've been doing that exclusively for the last 20 years. 00:42:27
And it's not a cleanup, it's a reclamation, so. 00:42:30
We go to a gun club. 00:42:34
And if there is enough lead? 00:42:36
Then we offer to do it for free. 00:42:38
And then we give them a share of the revenue from the sales that we get from the lead. 00:42:40
And I've been to over 200 ranges. 00:42:45
Uh, reclaimed. Probably 100. 00:42:50
So I've tested all those other ones. 00:42:53
When they weren't sufficient. 00:42:54
Most of them I can weed them out over the phone. 00:42:57
You know, without going there. 00:42:59
I've been talking to Joe for several years, trying to. 00:43:01
Tell him you know this is not worth it. We don't need to do it. 00:43:05
But. 00:43:08
He was under the gun and we did it last year and. 00:43:09
You know I never charge for my services. 00:43:12
But I never do it if it's not worth it either and. 00:43:14
I felt really bad for having. 00:43:17
To do that place. 00:43:19
Because there was. 00:43:21
Hardly any lead and and I don't want to just go through the motions. 00:43:22
So we normally we put in. 00:43:25
Say 6. 00:43:27
Full 1 yard buckets of dirt. 00:43:28
And we get. 00:43:31
3000 lbs of lead out of it. 00:43:32
And I had to go through like 200 buckets of dirt. 00:43:34
To fill up one bag. 3000 lbs of lead. 00:43:37
And. 00:43:40
You know, the conditions were dry. We showed up the year before. 00:43:41
And it was too wet. 00:43:44
And then we came back when it was. 00:43:45
Drier and super dry. 00:43:47
But even under those conditions, it was very hard. 00:43:49
And we went through an incredible amount of dirt and I think we came up with two bags or. 00:43:51
5 or 6000 lbs of lead. 00:43:56
And then you know, what do I charge the man? I I felt so bad. 00:43:59
Even. 00:44:02
Doing it. 00:44:03
But I you know, I charge them what I would make on a. 00:44:05
On an average job. 00:44:07
And it's against my own interest to even go do an average job. 00:44:09
Because I'd rather do a good job, right? 00:44:12
And. 00:44:15
That's why my recommendation is do it when it's. 00:44:16
When it's ready. 00:44:19
Now the the. 00:44:20
And I I test so many sites and I see so many people that haven't. 00:44:21
Maintain their property the right way to PH's off. 00:44:25
And then the lead is corroded. 00:44:28
And then the bags weigh a lot less. 00:44:31
You lose a lot because it falls apart. 00:44:33
And then I've also seen places where they have the best management practices in place and they line the place, keep the. 00:44:35
PH neutral. 00:44:41
Or it's slightly above and then there's zero corrosion. 00:44:43
The lead looks like. 00:44:46
Pristine like it looks in California, where it never rains. 00:44:47
Even the Minnesota I've seen places where there wasn't 0 corrosion just because they. 00:44:50
They lined it and kept it. pH. 00:44:55
And then it can accumulate. 00:44:57
When it accumulates, you can also reclaim a bigger area because. 00:45:00
It starts heavy in the middle and it. 00:45:04
Gets thinner. 00:45:07
So because there's more lead, when you do it after 20 years, you will be able to get a huge. 00:45:08
Double the area or triple the area because. 00:45:13
It takes longer for it to. 00:45:15
To Peter out. 00:45:17
Right where it's not worth. 00:45:18
You know, throwing it in the machine and getting. 00:45:19
That let's show. 00:45:21
Doing it more often is only going through the motions and it's not benefiting anybody. 00:45:23
On top of that. 00:45:28
You know it. 00:45:29
It disturbs the grass which holds the soil in place. 00:45:30
You know, and this is. 00:45:33
Not good for erosion if you. 00:45:34
If you disturb everything. 00:45:37
So there's a lot of. 00:45:39
Pros to waiting longer. 00:45:40
And there's no benefits to doing it soon. 00:45:42
So so I have a question. 00:45:45
And probably put you on the spot, but. 00:45:47
OK, I thank the recommendation from. 00:45:49
Our planner is 10 years or 10 million shots or if the pH reaches a. 00:45:52
Certain level. 00:45:57
OK, you've been on site. 00:45:59
And in your experience? 00:46:01
My recommendation would be. 00:46:03
If the place floods then immediately check the pH. 00:46:05
Because then it. 00:46:09
You know it could be neutralized by the all the water going through. OK, Otherwise just lime it. 00:46:10
You know, once a year. 00:46:15
Or once every two years as long as the pH is still good. You don't have to lime it, but a flood or you know, could change that so. 00:46:16
And then as far as? 00:46:23
When to do it, I would go by the square foot sample. 00:46:25
So if there's an if. 00:46:28
If the square foot area. 00:46:30
Like in one square foot. 00:46:33
Of ground. 00:46:34
There would be 5 lbs of lead. 00:46:35
Then I would say. 00:46:37
It's great. Let's do it. 00:46:38
Because then I can do it. 00:46:40
It won't cost anything and I can give a. 00:46:41
A percentage back. 00:46:44
And yeah, I appreciate I have to interrupt you, but I appreciate. 00:46:45
You know, as far as the cost, but obviously the board would work what we're concerned about. 00:46:49
Is the safety for the for the public OK as far as you know, the water source and things of that nature, you've seen the site. 00:46:53
And you've seen, you know, the soil. What's this is this is a 0 risk site because there is no. 00:47:01
There's no steep hills where it can wash off. 00:47:07
OK, if if the river flooded and it started to flow, it would be a slow flow and it wouldn't move the lead. 00:47:09
OK, the lead only moves if it's on a steep slope and there's like a gully. 00:47:15
Right. Even in creeks. 00:47:19
It never leaves the Creek. It lays right in the bottom of the Creek and it just, it doesn't move. 00:47:21
So. 00:47:25
From a safe, from an environmental standpoint. 00:47:27
You have to prevent corrosion. 00:47:30
And the only way to prevent corrosion is by. 00:47:32
Keeping the pH. 00:47:35
Right, right. 00:47:36
And since. 00:47:37
Since it's. 00:47:38
You know it's laying on the ground. 00:47:39
And it gets rained on and and and it could corrode. 00:47:41
You you have to stop that by keeping the. 00:47:46
With the line, With the line, yeah, just. 00:47:49
Natural, natural product which helps grass which is good. So, so you mentioned that you eventually early on was environmental. 00:47:52
OK. Do you have any degree in our environmental or you just? 00:47:59
Cleaned up environmental. No, I was at microbiologist actually. OK, OK. 00:48:04
Yeah, you've still got 34 seconds less than that. 00:48:11
You're, you're also familiar, having expected the property and what equipment they have, they're able to do their own testing. 00:48:15
Yeah. I mean anybody that has a winery or a farm or. 00:48:20
Can do their own pH testing, right? So the idea that they got to pay a third party to come in and do the sampling and testing, is 00:48:24
that necessary here? No. 00:48:28
No, that's all the questions. So, so would you recommend with seeing the site? 00:48:32
Yeah. 00:48:37
And say in the shoot stations. 00:48:37
And you if you have the layout of the land, could you make a? 00:48:41
A. Relatively. 00:48:45
Intelligent. 00:48:46
Recommendation where? 00:48:49
To test regularly in that area where it's going. 00:48:51
The so so it's lined up where everything shoots, kind of. 00:48:54
You know, in the middle. 00:48:58
So you. 00:48:59
If you want to test the heaviest area. 00:49:01
And the shot will spread itself kind of evenly. 00:49:04
So. 00:49:07
If it's, if it's, if you're not, I mean, if you can see that shot laying there. 00:49:08
Or if you see it landing. 00:49:12
Or if you look at the layout you can immediately tell this is where I have to go test. 00:49:15
And then when you test that area. 00:49:19
You're looking for 5 lbs. 00:49:22
5 lbs of square foot in one square foot. So you you dig the dirt up. 00:49:24
And if there's been? 00:49:28
If there's been flooding, then you could have. 00:49:29
Several layers of dirt. 00:49:31
Right. Because it could deposit, you know, a layer of seals, right? 00:49:33
So you go down until you see no more lead. 00:49:36
Usually that's three or 4 inches. 00:49:39
One square foot. You can put it in a 5 gallon bucket or two buckets if you need. 00:49:41
And then just wash it out. Wash all the. 00:49:46
With a garden hose. 00:49:49
And the lead will just fall right to the bottom and then you weigh it. 00:49:50
OK, and clarify something. 00:49:53
Go ahead. 00:49:55
The the the £5 per square foot makes it profitable. 00:49:56
For you. 00:50:00
To come do it. 00:50:01
And not have to pay the property owner. 00:50:02
Where it's not like you would prefer to do. 00:50:04
Yeah, yeah, yeah. His question was is there a location? So, so you've already established my understanding is. 00:50:07
You're not going to find a £5 per square foot LOC. 00:50:13
Far last time we did it. His question as I understood it. 00:50:16
Is is there a way? 00:50:20
Under in these circumstances. 00:50:22
To identify the most. 00:50:24
Idealistic areas to sample. 00:50:26
For the pH, yeah, that's what that's what. So that is in the heaviest area, in the heaviest shot falls. Can you could you identify 00:50:28
that for them on a map? 00:50:32
So I'd like to make that part of whenever the testing we have a map and. 00:50:39
Where his recommendation for the. 00:50:43
Whatever. So thank you very informational. Anybody else? 00:50:46
The last thing I'd like to say is you can in a normal situation. 00:50:49
You can reclaim. 00:50:53
Easily down to 1 LB per square foot. 00:50:54
So I know it said £2 per square foot. 00:50:57
But that's an average. 00:51:00
So. 00:51:02
If you're starting in an area with. 00:51:03
5 lbs or 10 lbs. I mean, I've seen 20 lbs. 00:51:05
Then you keep working, working, working. 00:51:09
To where it gets below 1 LB a square foot and then it becomes questionable. 00:51:11
OK. Still keep going. OK. 00:51:15
On the testing, no one on the on the reclamation. 00:51:17
When you actually start reclaiming. OK, gotcha. Yeah, OK, Yeah. So if you're testing it now and it's half a pound. 00:51:21
And it's been five years. 00:51:27
Then you know you need five more years to get to 1 pension. 00:51:28
Gotcha. OK. If the shot is equal, I mean, obviously just in the heaviest area. I got you just in the. 00:51:31
Heaviest area OK. 00:51:37
Yeah, thank you. Because you got you got dealing with five acres. 00:51:38
15 acres. Sorry, 1550 acres of the whole thing. Where? 00:51:42
Of which 15 acres would be the reclaimable area. OK. 00:51:46
All right, we're out of time. So all right, thank you. 00:51:50
All right. OK at this time. 00:51:52
The anybody. 00:51:56
Anybody like to speak in favor of this? 00:52:00
Adam, please come forward this time state your name and address for the record. 00:52:03
Seeing that, nobody came forward. 00:52:12
We'd now like to open up for anybody in opposition. 00:52:15
And. 00:52:18
Welcome. Thank you, Mr. Ram. 00:52:21
State your name. Good evening, Board. My name is John Hughes. I'm an attorney from the law firm of Bozeman. Kenny Evans. 00:52:24
Address at 111 Monument Circle, Suite 2700, in Indianapolis. 00:52:30
It's good to see you Miss Runner and Mr. Ripple Hauser again. I feel like I was just saying a. 00:52:35
Thank you. Nick had a baby one time. We're down here. I feel like I know you guys so well. Excited down here so much. 00:52:39
Good to see you again. I'm here again representing 2 families. It's Paul and Julie Riley who are. 00:52:44
Here with me and Andrew and Angela Lush. We're also here with me. 00:52:50
And we're their neighbors to the farm. 00:52:55
And. 00:52:57
I appreciate you giving me a little bit extra time. I'll try not to take all of it. I don't know if anybody else wants to speak, 00:52:58
but I'll try to. 00:53:01
Leave some on the clock if I can. 00:53:04
I've given you a few materials here that are in front of Miss Fox. 00:53:06
That may help you follow along this binder. 00:53:10
I submitted these materials and I'll apologize they were sent late. 00:53:12
As you all know this, I was hired the day after you had your last meeting on March 9th to come back down here. I was hard hired on 00:53:16
March 10th. 00:53:19
At that time I understood I had until April 14th. Probably shouldn't have taken this assignment with all the work I had going on. 00:53:22
To get here today, but since the meeting got moved up I just did the best I could and I apologize if they're late. 00:53:29
They were given to you late. 00:53:34
But in this I'll go over this PowerPoint. 00:53:35
Kind of slide deck here. That'll be the easiest way to follow along and we'll reference those binder materials if we need to. So 00:53:39
if you'll turn to page 2 of this, document the slide deck. 00:53:43
Just for clarification, sorry, do you have an extra set for staff? 00:53:47
That's OK, I just want to make sure. 00:53:52
We have one. 00:53:54
I just want to make sure that nobody that we have a set to go into the record. 00:53:56
You don't have one, I'll take one, but I just want to make sure we have a set to go into the record one for the board members. 00:54:00
There's another one there, Mr. 00:54:06
Phillips used one. 00:54:08
Can add it to. Sorry to interrupt. 00:54:09
So the materials that I've submitted to you, I just want to summarize those for you. 00:54:20
In this binder, you'll find a letter of today's date. In that letter, I explained why. 00:54:25
From my perspective as a lawyer, the farm is not established. The five. 00:54:29
Elements that they must establish to meet their burden on this special exception. 00:54:34
I also presented a staff 7 YouTube videos which were really interesting to watch for me. 6 of them are. 00:54:38
Three are from a 2025 Total Archery Challenge. Three are from a 2024 Total Archery Challenge. 00:54:44
They're content creators who are out on the course. 00:54:49
And they they really give you a feel for what's going on, how they shoot back in the woods, how they climb these hills. 00:54:52
I'll tell you it's fascinating and interesting, but it gives you a much better context for content for what happens. 00:54:58
In the written materials in this binder, I've put exhibits A through F in here as well. 00:55:03
Exhibit AI took the videos and I tried to distill them to a quick narrative to give you some screenshots of them, so you can flip 00:55:08
through pictures there if you want. Really, the reason I was providing them is Mr. Beeblehauser at the. 00:55:13
Think it was a November meeting you you mentioned like we're not sure how these arrows were getting to the lush property over 00:55:18
these hills. 00:55:21
And if you watch those videos, you'll see that's where they're shooting. They're back in the hill, shooting on top of the hill, 00:55:24
shooting down. You'll see the one of the content creators indicated that they were shooting at angles of 20° positive and 33° 00:55:29
negative, which is different from what staff has recommended in terms of parallel. So that's why that's provided is for that 00:55:34
context. You'll also see a couple areas where they were shooting close to the Riley residence just to give you some. 00:55:39
Appreciation for the concerns my clients have. 00:55:45
Exhibit B is an I'm not a lead reclamation guy. Arjun knows has forgotten more about lead reclamation than I myself will know. So 00:55:49
I'm not up here to tell you how that should happen or not, but I have provided a material from. 00:55:56
An individual named Chris Abel. Chris Abel is certified in heavy metals. 00:56:02
And removal of heavy metals from properties and has done. 00:56:08
Gun ranges and I asked him if you just look at this material and say what we need and he's provided an Exhibit B some areas, he 00:56:10
thinks there's some gaps of things that we ought to look at. 00:56:14
I think we ought to distrust an expert, and so that's kind of what I think we should do on that rather than try to come up with 00:56:19
rules on our own. I don't think we'll ever get the right rules, so. 00:56:22
We should trust an expert. 00:56:27
Exhibit C is a history of the boundary and landscape and that section I talked about the fact that. 00:56:28
The 200 yard boundary that we have today. 00:56:34
That was actually at. 00:56:36
The farms request, that was in 2021. In September they came forward and said. 00:56:38
We need to move our boundary. We don't ever need to move closer to the Riley property, but give us this other area over here in 00:56:43
the yellow in the South. 00:56:46
Eastern part of the property. 00:56:50
So I gave that history and also the landscaping. Mr. Phillips mentioned the landscaping. There was landscaping installed. I'll 00:56:52
show you kind of the general area where that was and why. 00:56:55
New landscaping is needed for these new requests. 00:56:59
Exhibit D This on this chart says location targets from 24. That's actually 25. Those are locations that Mister Loesch identified 00:57:02
where he saw targets next to his property from last year. 00:57:06
Exhibit E is minutes from 2021 and because we had a partial meeting on March 9th, I just provided a transcript of that, but I 00:57:12
asked the quarter to provide. 00:57:16
That's Exhibit F So if you turn to tab, page three of my my slide deck here. 00:57:20
This is a real summary of why we think it should be denied. There's five elements. We don't think we've met them. 00:57:25
That's in my letter. 00:57:30
If the board is going to grant it, we can just move on to talk about what those are, but in general? 00:57:31
I don't believe they met the unnecessary hardship. They're operating a gun range, they're operating an archery range. They have to 00:57:36
show you that they can't operate some profitable operation and they have been since 2019. So I don't think that's. 00:57:41
Shown also as I mentioned, the border was created by them. So I think it's a self-imposed hardship. Indiana law says you can't get 00:57:47
it for that. 00:57:50
And I also don't think they've shown peculiar condition. 00:57:54
I think health, safety and welfare will be harmed if we move closer to people's properties. I think their property values be 00:57:57
adversely affected if we move closer. 00:58:00
And the comprehensive plan, I appreciate what what Mr. Walden said, He knows that comprehensive plan better than I do. I just 00:58:04
point out that in general, this area is supposed to be agricultural and this is an expanding commercial use. 00:58:09
OK, so. 00:58:15
Moving on to Tab 4 because. 00:58:15
I could go on and on about why legally I think it shouldn't be granted, but let's just get to if we're going to grant this, what's 00:58:17
reasonable? 00:58:20
And I kind of want to take the temperature down just a little bit. 00:58:23
I want to thank Mr. Phillips. Mr. Phillips and I had some really good conversations in the last week. Weren't able to get a 00:58:25
resolution, but I got to tell you it was a breath of fresh air to have a good conversation about. 00:58:30
Can we agree to to figure this out? 00:58:35
I also want to thank the board because I know I've left here several meetings thinking. 00:58:37
Man, that didn't turn out the way that I was hoping. And then I'm driving up the Annapolis. By the time I got home, I thought, 00:58:41
well, the board really balanced the interests of everybody. So I know it's a tough job. I don't envy your job, but I appreciate 00:58:45
that you. 00:58:48
Considered my clients concerns, considered the farms operations and found a good balance so. 00:58:52
Here's what we propose is a good balance in general. 00:58:56
I think the staff report is workable, as Mr. Phillips said, with a few tweaks. 00:58:59
First of all. 00:59:04
We believe the boundary needs to be 300 yards per shotgun now. I think that's in. 00:59:05
Anticipated in their request because they didn't ask to move the shotgun targets for Clay. 00:59:09
But we don't see any reason to move. 00:59:14
Upland shotgun game hunts closer to the property. That'll bring noise closer to the property. 00:59:16
And the staff report? 00:59:20
Has a. 00:59:22
Boundary that says no shot fall in that 300 yard buffer. I think that's going to be confusing. 00:59:23
Who's going to track where the shot fall goes? I think a much easier rule is usually you can shoot. Here's where you can't shoot. 00:59:27
And we should just keep that at 300 yards. 00:59:32
Same for archery. 00:59:34
Staff recommended a 50 yard buffer for archery, but it's a shot fall area. I think that's going to be difficult to implement so. 00:59:36
We think it should be 50 yards and shoot away from the property. 00:59:43
If you're shooting back towards the property, it can't land in that 50 yard zone. 00:59:46
I think that's consistent with what staff says, except we think that 50 yards should be no shooting in. 00:59:49
And no shooting out if you turn to the next page. 00:59:54
I'm not as good of a cartographer as Mr. Walden, so I borrowed your work. Sorry, Mr. Walden. 00:59:56
I changed his work a little bit, as all good lawyers do. 01:00:02
So Mr. Walden put together a archery boundary or a boundary map and and I suggest what I think is reasonable, so. 01:00:05
As I understand staff report, they're saying essentially someone could stand on the 5 yard line right outside my client's property 01:00:14
and shoot. 01:00:17
Out away from the property. 01:00:20
We don't think that's reasonable for a commercial use of the property to be that close to this rural residential area and it's 01:00:22
always been 300. 01:00:25
So we think moving it back. 01:00:29
That 5 yard buffer should just be the landscape buffer. 01:00:30
And although it goes around the whole property, the only area I'm really concerned about is around the Riley residence. 01:00:33
The 10 yard set back that was from a prior docket and I don't think there's any requests to remove that. 01:00:39
That's the area on the far right of the map that you'll see there. 01:00:43
Then we have the 50 yard. 01:00:47
Buffer. I've called it the 50 yard archery shot. No shot into or out of area. 01:00:49
So don't, don't shoot. 01:00:53
Arrows in there. 01:00:55
From there, and don't shoot arrows into there. I think that's an easy rule to follow. We can mark the boundary. 01:00:56
Everybody knows what the rule. 01:01:00
And then on the hunting. 01:01:02
I I'm concerned about the shopfall area if anybody been has been up on game hunting or bird hunting. You follow the bird. So if 01:01:04
the birds moving into the area and you're already standing there. 01:01:08
You're gonna shoot, but then we have to figure out where the shot fell. I just think that's a really hard. 01:01:13
Hard rule to follow. 01:01:18
So if we just keep them 300 yards away, that keeps the noise down even for the upland game hunts and. 01:01:19
A reminder back in 13 that's what they were asking was upland game hunts. 01:01:24
And they said we don't need to get closer to the Riley property. 01:01:28
So that's the map I would request that we adopt. 01:01:30
Moving to the landscape buffering that we would request. 01:01:34
Staff. 01:01:38
I'm a little confused on where we are because I think in the applicants petition they said they were going to plant trees. 01:01:39
But I thought I heard them say when they came up here that they don't think they should have to plant more, so I'm not exactly 01:01:44
sure what the request is. 01:01:47
I think what staff said was we agreed trees should be planted but we should follow the rule of. 01:01:50
Planting about 6 foot at the time we plant them. 01:01:54
So that's what I'm going to go over and explain why we think that makes sense. 01:01:57
The Riley residence needs landscape buffering, and here's why. If you turn to page 7, you'll see. 01:02:01
I've zoomed in on that map and Mr. Walden created that green area is the parking area that they use for these tack events. They're 01:02:06
parking right next to the Riley. 01:02:10
Property. 01:02:14
So we have a heavy use of parking, which is a commercial use. 01:02:15
These events have been happening in the summer when the daylight hours are longer. 01:02:19
We're now doing it in the spring where it's going to be darker for periods, which means we're probably going to have light 01:02:23
pollution from those cars. 01:02:26
The yellow area that's circled on there is generally. 01:02:29
Where landscaping was installed. And that made sense because it was, you know, shooting within 300 yards. So the landscaping was 01:02:32
to buffer. 01:02:35
The shooting stations. 01:02:39
From the Riley property there was number landscaping. 01:02:41
Closer to them. So if we're going to move commercial activity closer to them. 01:02:43
We should buffer the area. 01:02:47
Mr. Unruh, I'm going to borrow your comments on the next page. 01:02:49
When we came here on buffering before and we talked about that issue back in 2013, there were little baby saplings in Mr. Hunter, 01:02:53
he said. Give him some 10 foot trees, hide the shooting stations, be a good neighbor. 01:02:58
I mean, that's what we're asking to do here as well. 01:03:04
And the next tab you'll or the next page, you'll see buffer types. Your your zoning ordinance, as you know, provides two different 01:03:08
buffer types, Type 1 and type 2. 01:03:11
Type 1 is to buffer, usually like uses. Type 2 is to buffer differing uses, usually residential from a commercial. 01:03:15
I acknowledge that their property is zoned the same as my clients property, however because it has an SE use on it that's a 01:03:23
commercial use. 01:03:26
And staff has recommended that we look to the type 2 buffer. 01:03:30
Type 2 buffer requires A6 foot tall berm with six foot tall trees on it. 01:03:33
This area may or may not be able to have a berm. I talked to Mr. Creedy about it. He was concerned that maybe we couldn't put a 01:03:37
berm down there and if we can't then we think 10 foot tall trees. 01:03:41
Would be 12 feet with a six foot tree on top of a six foot berm but 10 foot tall trees. 01:03:46
Would sure make a difference now. 01:03:50
And the types of trees staff report indicated deciduous or Evergreen, They should be Evergreen. That's the only way we're going to 01:03:53
get a shield. 01:03:56
Also, if there's any any archery, any arrows that happen to go that way. 01:03:59
A little deciduous trees not going to catch it. It's possible that an Evergreen tree might stop it, although it's not a Great 01:04:04
Barrier, a burn would be better. 01:04:08
And we would request those to be giant green Arbor vitae variety because those are make a really nice screen. 01:04:12
The next page on 10 I just showed you a picture from last year's docket of what the parking looks like so you get a feel for. 01:04:17
How intense of A use it really is right next to their property. 01:04:23
And where this little white box is, that's the Riley property, just right down in this area, so right on their boundary. We're 01:04:26
parking this many cars. 01:04:30
Next page I'm going to show you some views of what their property looks like as of yesterday. 01:04:34
First view shows commercial activity going off in the distance even when the range isn't shut up set up yet. 01:04:39
But as we bring people closer to that, there's just nothing to buffer anything for the Riley's. They'll have people effectively in 01:04:44
their backyard if you let 50 people shoot 50 yards to their property. 01:04:49
Next picture shows across the pond, same thing. We won't have any buffering to see what's going on there. 01:04:54
Next page shows for Mr. Riley's driveway. Same thing. If we could just put that buffering there. 01:04:59
It would really protect his privacy and his ability to use his property. 01:05:04
Next one is from the barn that's on the other side of the driveway, and you can still see, although it gets better that distance, 01:05:08
there's still an opening. 01:05:11
In that area. So buffering is really important for them, Landscape buffering. 01:05:14
The next picture on page 15. 01:05:18
You'll recall in 24, I showed you some pictures of some people hunting back right by his house. This is kind of that area. It's 01:05:21
raised right behind their house. So if we have people that are just. 01:05:26
15. 01:05:30
Which is what staff said. You can shoot in behind this property. They're gonna be looking right down into it. 01:05:32
If we're 50 yards away. 01:05:36
Then we have much more protection. But if they're going to be that close, we got to do something for landscaping in this site too. 01:05:38
Even though there's trees, we got to do better than that. 01:05:42
Next page on 16 Why do I ask for 50 yards? So here's the reason. 01:05:46
Noise. 01:05:50
Shotgun clearly or for the 300 yard buffer for shotguns. Shotguns are clearly loud. We should keep them away from residential use. 01:05:51
Archery. 01:05:58
Sure. 01:05:59
A bow isn't that loud, but when you have. 01:06:00
1000 people or 16 people at a time is the individual set from Total Architect Challenge going to a force at a time? 01:06:02
There's going to be noise of just joviality and enjoying the day. 01:06:08
And that's all great, but. 01:06:12
We should keep them further away from the property so that the Rileys and the Lushes can enjoy their property. 01:06:13
2nd is privacy invasion. I'll talk about that a little bit more in just a minute, but again, with no buffers, there's a lot of 01:06:18
invasion of privacy. 01:06:21
50 yards gives them a ton of property. 01:06:25
A lot of property. 01:06:27
Next is the farm asked for 10 yards in their application, So why would we give them five in the staff report, right? At the 01:06:29
minimum it should be 10. 01:06:32
But even staff said 10 yards was not reasonable and we agree. 01:06:35
We think the 50 yards that staff has come up with is reasonable, balances everybody's interest. Just don't shoot in it and don't 01:06:39
shoot towards it. 01:06:42
Also, that gives them 250 more yards. 01:06:45
Right from every point, that's a lot of square yards. 01:06:49
Of of that they currently have for archery. We think that's a very reasonable position for us to take and trying to be good 01:06:53
neighbors with them. 01:06:56
And it prevents activity like that in 2024. I honestly hate showing you this picture again, but page 17. 01:07:00
This is an individual relieving himself during the event. I'm sure most people don't do that. I'm sure this guy was making a dumb 01:07:05
decision. 01:07:09
But if we keep people away from the property, then we don't have to worry about someone making a dumb decision, so that's why 01:07:12
we're asking. 01:07:15
50 yards. 01:07:18
Finally. 01:07:19
On the other conditions, so that was all in the buffer. 01:07:22
Finally, on the other conditions. 01:07:24
We'd request no night shooting. I think that's effectively what staff report has said they asked to shoot. 01:07:26
Globe clays they've asked for that before. 01:07:31
Just do it during daytime hours as as the staff, we can live with the staff recommendation on that. 01:07:33
Lead reclamation, I agree I think with what everybody said, which is let's trust an expert. I don't think any of us can come up 01:07:38
with the right time to test the lead or trying to protect the water supply. I think that's the water supply originally made that 01:07:42
issue. 01:07:46
Mr. van Buell said in his materials that more lead is always better. That's what he said in those questions, and I'm not sure 01:07:49
that's true. I'm I'm not a lead. 01:07:53
Reclamationist. 01:07:57
But I think we had to have them hire an independent person. Maybe Mr. Van Buren is I've I've never met him before. Not suggesting 01:07:58
he's not, but. 01:08:01
To do the testing and to provide that testing, as staff has said, to the public water supply to you. 01:08:04
You guys can make a decision. 01:08:09
I don't think we should just come up with arbitrary numbers. 01:08:11
Finally, on the people. 01:08:14
My view of that is. 01:08:16
At the March 9th meeting, you all made a decision to remove the people cap for this one event. Kind of see how it goes. I think 01:08:17
that's a reasonable position. 01:08:21
So I think we should see how this weekend goes. 01:08:24
And if things go, great. 01:08:26
Then we should make it permanent. 01:08:28
If things don't go great, then we can discuss what would be an appropriate cap. So that's our position. Just to sum it all up for 01:08:29
you, because I know I went over a lot if you look at in my letter in the. 01:08:34
Reminder at page 7. 01:08:40
I've laid out the alternative relief and I'll just sum it all up as I as I've just said now. So here's the alternative relief. If 01:08:43
you approve their request, here's what we would ask for as. 01:08:47
A reasonable accommodation. 01:08:52
Any shooting boundaries should be no shots from or into set area. 01:08:54
So that means for shotguns remain at 300 yards. 01:08:58
For upland hunts, keep it up 300 yards around the Riley property. 01:09:01
And the lush property. 01:09:05
The other properties. 01:09:07
I don't know if other people here to talk about it but I'm just concerned about my 2 clients. 01:09:08
For archery. 01:09:12
The 50 yard buffer should be a number shooting into or out of. 01:09:13
So no shooting from or into the 50 yard buffer. 01:09:17
A landscape buffer of 6 foot tall berm with six foot tall trees, or if that's not possible, a 10 foot tall trees around the Riley 01:09:20
property. 01:09:24
Boundaries should be marked immediately. It sounds like that's already occurred. I don't know which boundaries they marked, but if 01:09:27
they mark the 50 yard one then we're good. 01:09:30
And then? 01:09:34
The there was a requirement about Marshalls. I didn't mention this in my presentation. 01:09:36
And I understood we're gonna have marshals out there kind of walking. I feel a little bit more comfortable about what Tack has 01:09:40
said. 01:09:42
But we did have some issues last year and I'm not sure that they know the board's rules, so we want to make sure whoever does this 01:09:45
knows the board rules. 01:09:48
At the March 9th meeting, I heard Mr. Korea say that it was going to be. 01:09:51
2 marshals and I would just note there's five courses out there. 01:09:55
Of over 100 targets. 01:09:59
I'm a little and it's back up in the woods. I'm a little concerned that two marshals is not enough, so I recommend it for every 01:10:01
course. Yes Sir. 01:10:04
The intent. 01:10:07
Was that? 01:10:08
The farm would have two marshals to. 01:10:09
In addition to. 01:10:12
Text Marshall. OK, that's very helpful. Thank you. Mr. Bewilder, I just want to make sure we have enough people out there 01:10:14
monitoring and if we do? 01:10:17
That's that's OK with us. We just want to make sure it's done correctly. 01:10:20
#2. 01:10:24
Remove the cap on people for this weekend's event only. 01:10:25
And then if if it works great, then we can make it permanent. If it doesn't, we can adjust. 01:10:28
For the night shoots, except staff's report, we don't think there should be any night shoots that just disturbs everybody's sleep. 01:10:33
And at the Riley property and that lead reclamation should be by an approved soil scientist. I've given you a guy, Chris Ables, 01:10:39
the guy that I I know. 01:10:43
Could be anybody but somebody who does this. As a soil scientist, I don't have anything further help. Anybody else from their 01:10:47
monsters wants to say something. 01:10:50
Yeah, sure. Go ahead, Paul. 01:10:55
We are down to a minute and 1/2. 01:11:00
My name's Paul Riley and I live at 3934 Five Mile Lane. 01:11:02
And I'm on page 7, just circled area. 01:11:06
Where Mr. Unruh had him add extra. 01:11:09
Trees and stuff that was built. 01:11:12
That is a six foot burn that was built when they dug the sand pits so they could drive across that ravine. 01:11:15
In the flooding, and I've been down there for a long time and I've been in my boat and watched it and been out in it and 01:11:21
everything, hauled neighbors around and the water comes directly over. It has not affected the burn. 01:11:26
So it's OK to put a berm around both sides of our property? 01:11:31
And plant trees on won't affect the thing because that area right there. 01:11:35
Is exactly where the current comes around over 111. 01:11:39
And gets with it and crosses 5 mile. 01:11:42
It won't affect my property at all. 01:11:44
Let me ask you one question along that line. 01:11:47
There's a power line easement that comes through there. 01:11:50
There is and it goes across your property also and into theirs. 01:11:52
Yes. 01:11:56
I don't believe we can. 01:11:57
We're not supposed to plant trees in that easement. 01:11:58
So. 01:12:01
We can probably do something what you're talking about, but we're not. 01:12:04
We can't plant those trees in. 01:12:08
That part of your property line where the easement go passes OK. 01:12:10
Could it be something that could be trimmed occasionally? 01:12:13
They'll come in and cut them down. 01:12:16
I've seen it in my neighborhood. They cut down to my freaking oak tree that was right one foot inside the. 01:12:18
Easement, but there's a lot of other property there that they could find. 01:12:23
Yeah, which used to be your tree. You planted it. Yeah. But all this through here, they could plant this. Yes, Sir, they could. 01:12:26
They make a lot of this. They could plant too, which would help us because they do bring campers in. 01:12:31
For both of all the, you know, the big bigger events. 01:12:37
And it blocked the parking in the campus here also. 01:12:40
I understand the car line, you're right. 01:12:43
Thank you. 01:12:46
I've got a point of clarification so. 01:12:51
And I think it's. 01:12:53
Stems from the fact that this is a very long report. 01:12:54
I did not. 01:12:57
Exclude the glow clays shooting standard in there. 01:12:59
It's just one that I didn't have a comment on within my recommendations, so I apologize for the. 01:13:04
I'm sorry. 01:13:12
The night shoot. The night shoot glows. Yeah, it's page four of the staff report item. 01:13:12
F from what was proposed. 01:13:18
I didn't have a an alteration to that and so I didn't include it in my staff recommendations. 01:13:20
Which is mostly what I was doing because I also didn't. 01:13:27
Reiterate the. 01:13:30
The Four. 01:13:33
Testings of pH. I didn't reiterate that I just. 01:13:35
Referenced it. 01:13:38
Later. 01:13:39
So I just wanted as a point of clarification there. 01:13:40
I apologize for the misunderstanding there with the. 01:13:42
Opposition. So we're not changing the night whatever's in there now. I did not have a recommendation to change item F that's 01:13:45
listed on page 4. 01:13:49
OK. 01:13:53
OK. All right. 01:13:57
Is there anybody else that? 01:13:59
Want to speak in opposition? I'd leave 2 more minutes if somebody else wants to come up. 01:14:01
Anybody else say anything? Come up, we'll give you 2 minutes. 01:14:06
Tell me two minutes on it, will you Nick, please? 01:14:09
We let the other guy run over with the lead guy, so. 01:14:12
I keep interactive now my name's. 01:14:16
David Wright. 01:14:18
6887 Budd Rd. New. 01:14:20
I am ready. 01:14:24
Member and a customer never built Water Corporation. 01:14:26
We've got whales. 01:14:34
It's 2 miles down from the. 01:14:36
Form I do not know. 01:14:38
What the correct intervals? 01:14:43
How much lead? 01:14:45
I don't know all those things. 01:14:47
But we do need to make sure. 01:14:50
That we don't contaminate. 01:14:54
Six parts per million of. 01:14:58
Is the maximum cap. 01:15:01
Contaminant. 01:15:03
In drinking water. 01:15:05
We're a little bit over one part as we stand. 01:15:08
In in in the uh. 01:15:14
Report just a minute ago. 01:15:16
I'm not here trying to say. 01:15:19
You gotta do this and you gotta do that. 01:15:22
But to me, we need people that actually. 01:15:26
Study and work with groundwater. 01:15:31
To look at this. 01:15:34
I mean, I'm here. 01:15:37
You know, 3 to 5 lbs per square. 01:15:38
Foot and all that. 01:15:41
But I wondered. 01:15:43
Just not all of the shooting ranges. 01:15:47
Are in an area that floods. 01:15:51
Where the runoff goes through other people's property. 01:15:53
But I I think. 01:15:58
That we need to keep in mind. 01:16:00
The Edwardsville. 01:16:04
Has 7500. 01:16:07
Members. 01:16:09
They sailed to the town of Greenville. They wholesale to them. 01:16:12
Also to UH Lanesville. 01:16:18
I'll just hit, You know I don't want. 01:16:22
It come up here 10 years or 20 years from now. 01:16:26
Yeah, yeah. You know, the groundwater is contaminated. 01:16:30
The pond there on the farm. 01:16:35
That's an open breach. 01:16:38
That's been concerning for a long time. 01:16:41
So like I said, I don't have the. 01:16:45
But I I don't want the decision to be made. 01:16:49
You know well if you got so much lead. 01:16:52
Then it's profitable, Duke, I think we need to look at it. 01:16:56
From the environmental part. 01:17:00
Add customers. 01:17:03
That's all I got, Sir. 01:17:05
You go ahead. I got a question. Are you with Edwardsville Water? That's my question. 01:17:09
Are you on the board? Are you a member or what? 01:17:13
I'm a member and I'm on the board. 01:17:16
I have I'm a licensed. 01:17:20
Water treatment operator. 01:17:23
Let me let me ask you a question. 01:17:27
I know that Floyd Knobs water comes in samples. 01:17:30
Gets a sample from me every year. 01:17:33
And and I get a report on what's in my water. 01:17:35
I'm assuming. 01:17:38
That. 01:17:39
Your water company samples the water that comes out of the ground. I don't know where this daily monthly. 01:17:40
How often do you do it but you test? 01:17:47
You have a lead test as part of those results. 01:17:50
And so you have a history of where the lead is right now. 01:17:53
How much lead is in your current water? 01:17:56
He said one part. 01:17:59
And and I think you said one part per million right now. 01:18:00
Yes, so. 01:18:04
You're monitoring that? 01:18:08
And I would expect that, if that. 01:18:11
Starts to change. 01:18:14
That you either. 01:18:16
Contact the farm and say hey we think we got an issue here are you contact? 01:18:18
The county and say hey, it's changed. 01:18:22
We need to do. 01:18:24
More testing or something to figure out why it's changed? 01:18:25
Well, that did concern me and that does concern me. I'm, I'm not, I'm, I'm with you there. 01:18:31
Because I don't want to drink a bunch of water with lead in it. 01:18:37
So, and then just to follow up on that question, because we're out of time and I don't need to, I don't want to sound rude, but. 01:18:41
That the farm's been there for correct me how many years? 01:18:46
566 years, OK in the six years has that. 01:18:52
Water sample changed No. 01:18:58
OK. All right. So I think what we're trying to do just to make you feel better, and that's been our concern from day one. 01:19:01
Is the testing. 01:19:07
Is mandatory. 01:19:08
They're going to turn that into us. We've got to see that. 01:19:10
So we're very concerned about that and I will tell you that if you guys see anything. 01:19:13
That even remotely. 01:19:18
Signals that there's a change in it. We would expect that we would hear from it. 01:19:20
But we appreciate your concern because we're as concerned as you are, Mr. 01:19:23
David. 01:19:27
Well, I'm like you. 01:19:27
I don't wanna, you know, be drinking lead. 01:19:31
I don't want to be shocked and again, I'm not here saying. 01:19:35
This is the right answer. 01:19:39
But we need to be diligent. 01:19:42
And look, you don't make sure we don't have a problem we can't get rid of. 01:19:45
Thank you very much, David. 01:19:50
OK. This time we got opened back up for the applicants to rebut any comments that were made. You got 5 minutes, is that right? 01:19:53
10, I'm 10 minutes, so I've known John. 01:20:01
And we had very healthy conversations, so. 01:20:08
It was a real departure from what I gather. 01:20:11
Had occurred before we were involved and and and so that everyone's clearer. 01:20:13
They drank the water that the gentleman was talking about. 01:20:16
So they they don't want to do anything to contaminate themselves and won't. 01:20:19
I just want to go through a couple things. First of all. 01:20:22
I didn't realize there's Mr. Degat. 01:20:26
Is 33 years with the Army Corps of Engineers. 01:20:28
He's an expert. 01:20:31
On trees and erosion and he just tapped me and said if you put. 01:20:32
Trees on a berm. 01:20:37
That will accelerate their erosion, and he can speak to that. 01:20:38
But but there's so many more issues Secondly. 01:20:42
If we planted a 10 foot tree. 01:20:45
Every 12 feet. 01:20:48
On a 660 by 750 property line. 01:20:51
At $1000 a tree. 01:20:55
That I say that right, 1000. 01:20:57
Let's just let's have him spend $412,500 to. 01:21:00
Landscape the property. 01:21:04
That's not why we're here. 01:21:05
And the information that you were given in the PowerPoint raises some great questions. 01:21:07
That are not relevant to this inquiry. 01:21:12
If every person. 01:21:15
Who owns a residential property? 01:21:16
It's zoned residential agricultural. 01:21:19
Was next to another residential agricultural. 01:21:21
Property. 01:21:24
And they wanted to start a business. 01:21:25
You would then be required to treat all those people, all those. 01:21:28
Businesses like the farm the same way. 01:21:32
Because part of what you weren't told. 01:21:35
And what the staff has said to you. 01:21:38
Is that all the five? 01:21:40
Conditions of approval that we're seeking here. 01:21:43
Your staff's already determined have been met. 01:21:46
So it's not a matter of negotiating. 01:21:49
Landscaping. 01:21:52
Secondly. 01:21:54
So we're opposed to the burns. Here's the thing. And Mr. Bieber, Hauser, you said it. The utility easements we can't encroach on. 01:21:55
There are other. 01:22:02
Other issues with that? 01:22:03
In addition to that. 01:22:05
I just encourage if you haven't been out there. 01:22:08
Restricting shooting. You can't, because now. 01:22:10
I misunderstood the the presentation because on page. 01:22:14
If you'll go to page. 01:22:18
Whose pages are we looking at? 01:22:20
Who's Who's is it? 01:22:22
Four of the of their presentation. 01:22:23
I read it and I thought, hey we do agree. 50 yards for an archery. 01:22:27
Until I heard what you can't shoot in it or out of it. 01:22:30
OK. 01:22:34
There's 0 reasonableness. 01:22:35
Saying that I can't stand. 01:22:37
That way their house is behind me. 01:22:39
And shoot that way. 01:22:42
And somehow that's going to be injurious to the problem. I don't, I didn't think that's what he meant. No, that's exactly what was 01:22:43
said. They they have asked you. 01:22:47
So so go back to the recommendations, I think what? 01:22:50
He's wanting you to stay 50 foot from the land before you start shooting, not to be in the 50 yard. 01:22:54
Zone and shoot out of it. I think it's what I heard him say. I'll defer a minute because that's exactly what they asked you to do. 01:23:00
They've asked you. 01:23:07
To restrict no shooting into or out of. 01:23:09
Because what Mr. Hughes said, as I heard it was there was some confusion about the shot fall. 01:23:11
I had the same confusion initially. 01:23:16
So if I'm mistaken I will stand down on that. 01:23:18
That's what was requested earlier and that that there's. 01:23:21
Well, I guess I'm confused right now myself. So between the two, between what you've said and what? 01:23:24
So I am a little confused because. 01:23:29
I'm happy to progressive your question. 01:23:33
Are you done? 01:23:35
A moment to clarify that is about. 01:23:38
I have one question for him and then we'll come back. We'll go back to this. 01:23:41
Into and out of stuff however you want to do it. I just want to clear. 01:23:45
Let me, let me, let me ask. 01:23:48
Mr. Hughes, Joe, one question. 01:23:51
Over. 01:23:54
How many shots do you? 01:23:55
Are being shot. 01:23:57
At per year. 01:23:59
No, I'm not talking Archer, I'm talking shotguns and stuff. 01:24:01
Are you figured 500? 01:24:04
Are you shooting 500? 01:24:06
You're shooting 3/4 of. 01:24:08
Yeah, between 300, between 7:50 and a million right now is the. 01:24:10
Is probably the average. 01:24:13
Is that just recent year or you think? It's been pretty consistent over the last two years, I'd say. 01:24:14
They're just past two years. 01:24:19
Yes. 01:24:21
OK. That's my only question. 01:24:22
Now let's get let's. 01:24:25
I'd like 30 because my notes were specific and I if I'm wrong, I'd be happy to be wrong. You got it. You got the floor. Go ahead. 01:24:28
Keep going. Mr. Hughes, would you come forward, please? 01:24:33
When it comes to the 50 foot. 01:24:40
Zone I think. 01:24:42
What I heard you asking for. 01:24:44
It's you don't want them standing in the 50 foot zone. 01:24:47
Even though their targets. 01:24:51
Their targets not on. 01:24:52
Their targets insect inward. 01:24:54
Yep, you don't want to. I assume you don't want them standing in that 50. 01:24:56
Yards. They start shooting at your target you want them to be on. 01:25:01
Yard 51 before they start shooting. Yeah, that's right. I think that's what Mr. Phillips was saying, yeah. 01:25:03
My, my, our request is right now that's the rule is no shooting in the 200 yard buffer. I think that's pretty. 01:25:08
Are you in it? Are you not? And so the easy way to say is 50 yard buffer makes sense so. 01:25:15
No shooting in that 50 yard buffer, just stay out of it and. 01:25:19
Shoot the other direction. 01:25:21
OK. Thank you. 01:25:24
That's what that's what I understood. And that's contrary to what? 01:25:26
The gentleman has indicated. 01:25:29
What what Mr. Walden has indicated is that there be no shot falling. Here's the thing. 01:25:31
If if. 01:25:36
If we were shooting things that could you. 01:25:38
Like like a boomerang. 01:25:40
Hey, you shoot it that way, it'll circle back. 01:25:41
That's one thing. We're not doing that. 01:25:43
And the 50 yard buffer is what it is. 01:25:46
But if we're shooting and and. 01:25:50
Mr. Degas already confirmed this. Everything is going away. 01:25:52
And internal. 01:25:55
So we're asking that because what's going to happen here? And ladies and gentlemen. 01:25:57
Is we're going to have the same thing that happened last year? 01:26:00
You'll get a complaint. 01:26:03
Will be in violation. 01:26:05
Will be on the 51st, but because of the depth perception of the picture, which is exactly what happened on five mile length. 01:26:06
We're going to have to spend more money to come back and defend something. 01:26:12
That has nothing to do. 01:26:15
Put the safety of their property. 01:26:17
With respect to the picture of the gentleman going to the bathroom. 01:26:20
Oh, that was from a. 01:26:23
Trail camera. 01:26:25
In the woods. 01:26:26
And it was 100 yards or more from the Riley property. 01:26:28
I understood. 01:26:32
And talking to John. 01:26:33
That it was next to their home and it was not. 01:26:35
So here's the thing. 01:26:37
I want to be very clear here. 01:26:39
If these people. 01:26:41
See somebody doing something inappropriate? They're gone. 01:26:42
Had had Joe or Marty? 01:26:46
Or anybody else, Rob? 01:26:49
Seen something like that? They're gone. 01:26:51
There's it's not a negotiable. 01:26:54
So that you know again. 01:26:55
That's not going to happen. 01:26:57
That we're not going to let that happen. 01:26:58
The other thing I wanted to talk about is this. 01:27:00
It's a little. 01:27:07
I'm I'm I'm impressed with the boldness of quoting Mr. Unruh. 01:27:08
But there was a part of this that wasn't read. 01:27:13
To Mr. Unruh's credit and his benefit. 01:27:16
What he said was. 01:27:19
Buy some 10 foot trees and at least try to eliminate some of the noise. 01:27:20
The board is here to protect the citizens of the county. Being a good neighbor and friendly is one thing, but you have to stop 01:27:25
some of the noise. 01:27:28
OK, you didn't set a minimum tree size. 01:27:31
Can they put trees? 01:27:35
And now? 01:27:36
This isn't a noise thing. 01:27:38
They've complied. This is I don't, I don't want to see something that I don't want to see. So the bottom line is this. 01:27:39
We've made the request as reasonable as we think it can. It's subject to your approval. 01:27:45
But the idea that the statute hasn't been met based on the recommendations of your staff. 01:27:50
So I would not want to be. 01:27:55
There is no legal challenge to the balance of what they've recommended and what you have the right to prove. 01:27:57
Want to say anything in addition? 01:28:03
We appreciate your time. Thank you very much for your time. All right, thank you. 01:28:05
Alright, I'm done. 01:28:09
Huh. I'm done. Yeah. OK. All right. 01:28:10
Alright. 01:28:14
All right, so that pretty well ends that portion. What now? We're looking for a ballot. 01:28:17
And permission I need. I need a few minutes. I need a few minutes of. 01:28:23
OK. 01:28:28
See if I want to make some adjustments. So give me a few minutes, take a breath. 01:28:30
Don't take a little break or whatever. 01:28:34
I'm not. You can go to the bathroom, but I I don't guarantee you might not miss something. 01:28:36
Yup. 01:28:46
You think it'll take you like 5 minutes? 01:28:49
What take a rush you but you think about 5 minutes? 01:28:58
Yeah, it could take a 5 minute pause or something. 01:29:03
You won't take about. 01:29:06
I would estimate it's probably take about 5:00-ish minutes, so if you may need to use rest, we're not going to. 01:29:08
Break the meeting but. 01:29:12
I think you're probably safe for about 5 minutes. 01:29:13
Can I just say, could we determine what you're talking about? Yeah, that's why I said turn off the lights. 01:29:15
Kyrie won't turn yours off to the place. 01:29:22
For 40 years you didn't have these. 01:31:12
I was just looking after your problem, I don't know. 01:31:36
I saw the movie. 01:32:12
The sun comes up the next day. 01:32:21
It's still like 2. 01:32:26
Rooster and a hand. 01:32:30
Little girl, they live with me. 01:32:32
16 month old. 01:32:38
Shake a bucket. It's pretty good. 01:33:30
Well, you've been. 01:33:41
Yeah, yeah. 01:33:59
Oh no. 01:34:09
Yeah. 01:34:14
All right. We're ready to get started back again. Thanks for your patience. 01:37:06
Everybody gets saddled down and we'll. 01:37:12
Go on with the meeting. 01:37:14
All right. As we stated, we're looking for a ballot. 01:37:18
Special exception ballot Docket FC O2-206-08. 01:37:22
Petition of the sporting club at the farm. 01:37:28
After careful review, the board finds. 01:37:30
That one, the special exception, will not be interest to the public health, safety, morals and gender welfare of the community 01:37:33
because. 01:37:37
Altering the boundary for hunting and archery. 01:37:40
Are found to. 01:37:44
Were found to, not. 01:37:49
Be interested in areas where the rugged train. 01:37:50
OK, nature. 01:37:53
Where the rugged? 01:37:56
Nature of the surrounding landscape and wooded buffers offer protection from neighboring properties and where archery and hunting 01:37:57
activities are not aimed towards these neighboring properties. 01:38:02
Additionally, hunting activities. 01:38:07
Are found to be less frequent. 01:38:09
And in less intensity. 01:38:11
Than shooting stations which are still limited. 01:38:12
In their location, so long as hunters are clearly aware of the property lines. 01:38:15
They better soil mining system will be improved the lead. 01:38:19
Mitigation efforts. 01:38:22
#2. 01:38:24
The use and value of the area adjacent to the property subject to the special exception. 01:38:25
Will not be affected in substantial inverse manner. 01:38:29
Because by right, the site currently allows for agriculture uses such as logging operations. 01:38:32
Which would have more of an impact? 01:38:37
Then the changes proposed to the current use. 01:38:39
A large portion of the site is buffered by substantial wooded areas. 01:38:42
Natural terrain. 01:38:46
Which is a dispersion. 01:38:47
Of proposed activities, limits to disruptions are provided through time restrictions. 01:38:49
Buffers. 01:38:54
Landscaping. 01:38:55
Are required to shield residential areas and requirements. 01:38:57
On the directions in which the shoots are allowed to be fired, shots are to be fired. 01:39:00
And landscaping provisions #3 The need for the special exception does arise from some condition peculiar to the property on file. 01:39:05
Because the sighting Compass is over 500 acres with highly irregular topography, extensive wooded buffers. 01:39:12
Elevation changes and multiple natural. 01:39:19
Unique to the site. 01:39:22
A large portion of the site is not buildable due to flooding or elevation limiting the. 01:39:23
Typical use of the property. 01:39:28
#4 the strict application of the terms of the Floyd County Zoning orders. 01:39:30
Growth result in. 01:39:34
Necessary hardship and the use of product because this use is not specified in the zoning ordinance. 01:39:35
Thus requiring a special exception. 01:39:40
The previous conditions are so restrictive that could be a. 01:39:42
Effectively opt. 01:39:46
Could could not effectively operate the business. 01:39:47
Previous experience by the applicant. 01:39:49
As managed this type. 01:39:51
Abuse reflection actual safe condition that. 01:39:53
This site provides due to the terrain. 01:39:56
And their operational capabilities? 01:39:58
#5. 01:40:01
Approval of the special exception will. 01:40:02
Contradict. 01:40:04
Will not contradict the goals and detectives. 01:40:05
Of the Floyd County comprehensive plan because of 2017 vision Floyd County comprehensive plan. 01:40:08
Details Community Pre. 01:40:13
Preferences which list. 01:40:15
A preference for more recreational and park activities and more entertainment and culture events. 01:40:17
Further, a sporting club fits within the. 01:40:22
Community Vision. 01:40:27
Themes under the plan and visit. 01:40:28
Providing recreational for local communities and a regional tourism destination. 01:40:32
The Board of Zoning Appeals hereby grants the petitioners special exception at the meeting held on the 26th of March, 2026. 01:40:37
Approval of the board is subject to. 01:40:44
To the completion of the funding conditions #1. 01:40:46
Property boundaries are to be marked. 01:40:50
To the specifications. 01:40:52
Indicate specification of Indiana Code 35-403-2-2. 01:40:54
With purple painting trees. 01:40:59
At 3:00 to 5:00 feet height and not more than 100 feet from the nearest. 01:41:01
Marked other. 01:41:06
Nourished other marked. 01:41:07
The property line is to be marked by the beginning. 01:41:09
Of the shooting. 01:41:14
Preserves licensed game bird hunting period by September the 1st. 01:41:15
#2 Hunting or archery shots fall to occur within the 50 yards of any property line. 01:41:21
No hunting. 01:41:26
Or archery shotfall to occur within the 50 yards. 01:41:27
Of any property line or public roadway. 01:41:30
Accept a continued. 01:41:34
300 buffer for the Riley residents where hunting shot. 01:41:36
Well, is not permitted, but where archery would be allowed. 01:41:39
For the attached boundary plan. 01:41:43
Shotfall areas are being defined as the area to the side or behind the target. 01:41:46
Where shots may be reasonably expected to land. 01:41:51
But not. 01:41:54
To restrict shots that may fall short of a target. 01:41:55
#3 No. 01:41:59
No trails firing. 01:42:00
Of weapons or commercial activities such as, but not limited to, parking, camping, or porta potties. 01:42:02
Are permitted within the five yards. 01:42:09
Of the property line. 01:42:11
When adjacent to the rally. 01:42:12
Riley property line. 01:42:14
From the existing tree Latin buffer to the parline easement. 01:42:17
A row of non evasive Evergreen trees at a height of 6 feet, placed every 12 feet. 01:42:25
Of the contiguous boundary. 01:42:32
#4 Archery station should follow. 01:42:34
The recommendations of the most recent archery trade. 01:42:37
Association archery range guide for community parks. 01:42:41
As. 01:42:45
By Indiana DNR rules. 01:42:46
Safety listed. 01:42:48
Safety must be posted. 01:42:50
At the shooting stations. 01:42:53
#5 existing. 01:42:55
Events exceeding 500 will require certified traffic control for the duration of the event. 01:42:58
Events with 500 fear would. 01:43:03
Will implement traffic control as required by Indiana dot. 01:43:05
Number six. 01:43:10
Camping chant RRV is allowed. 01:43:11
For the same dates of the temporary use permit, the applicant is required to contract. 01:43:14
The health department prior to issues. 01:43:19
To gain guidance and to and. 01:43:21
Any required permitting for overnight stays? 01:43:24
Camping is permitted in an area outside the commercial buffer as long as it is a safe location. 01:43:27
Camping location. 01:43:33
Shelby Camp. 01:43:35
Camping location shall be designed at the. 01:43:36
Designated at the time of the temporary use permit application. 01:43:39
#7 operating hours for hunting and archery activities. 01:43:43
Is to follow migratory bird. 01:43:46
And waterfowl. 01:43:48
Hunting hours of 1/2 hour. 01:43:49
Before sunrise to sunset, operating hours for the shooting. 01:43:52
Station is Tuesday to Saturday 9. 01:43:56
AM to half hour before sunset. 01:43:59
And Sunday noon, the half hour before sunset. 01:44:02
#8 The four required pH testing for soil samplings. 01:44:05
Must occur in accordance with the specification list in Appendix C of the Environmental Stewardship Plan. 01:44:09
The four required testings must be at least 45 days apart. 01:44:14
And performed by an independent third party. 01:44:17
Testing results will be provided. 01:44:20
As an annual report by the March 1st of each year. 01:44:23
To the Floyd County Planner, with copies to the Floyd County Stormwater Director. 01:44:26
And to the local provider. 01:44:30
Ask concerned party, local water provider as a concerned parties. 01:44:33
The report shall contain a. 01:44:37
With the locations of where the samples were taken, this report should include the number of rounds fired. 01:44:39
For the last year. 01:44:45
The Edwardsville Water Company. 01:44:47
Water quality report. 01:44:49
Is to be. 01:44:51
Included in the annual report. 01:44:52
And the requirements for lead reclamation will be triggered by the following events. 01:44:55
A 10 years from the last LED reclamation. 01:45:01
Our 10 million rounds. 01:45:04
Whichever occurs first, or. 01:45:06
If the test. 01:45:12
PH levels fall outside of the 6.5 to 8.5 per EPA management practice for lead. 01:45:14
At the outdoor shooting ranges. 01:45:21
Ideal range for three consecutive testing. 01:45:23
Soil testings #10 Do the site being in a flood way, care must be given to prevent excessive erosion as it is required to maintain 01:45:26
vegetation stabilization and shotfall area. 01:45:32
And maintain overlapping shotfull. 01:45:39
Containment. 01:45:41
#11 The applicant will submit an updated plan to the. 01:45:43
Planning staff within 90 days of any amendment. 01:45:47
To the conditions which impacts environmental stewardship, including this request. 01:45:51
That completes my ballot. 01:45:56
All right, we have a ballot. I need a second. 01:46:00
Set. Oh, I'm sorry. 01:46:03
I have a ballot in a second. 01:46:06
2nd. 01:46:07
All right. Any discussion? 01:46:09
I do have some discussion. 01:46:12
OK. 01:46:14
Just as a point of clarification. 01:46:16
From my understanding for Staffs understanding. 01:46:19
The glow shooting events are permitted as requested in this. 01:46:22
Or are they restricted as? 01:46:27
Normal operating hours. 01:46:31
I didn't address that at all. My my understanding though was that. 01:46:34
It was. 01:46:40
Not. 01:46:41
Modify the request was. 01:46:42
Not put a condition on it to restrict it. 01:46:44
So their request, their application would be being approved. I just wanted that clarification because you didn't put an additional 01:46:48
condition on the. 01:46:51
Which is fine, I just wanted that clarification and staff has no recommendation. 01:46:55
Staff was OK with the request made. 01:47:00
You're OK with the request made so that? 01:47:02
I don't have to address it then. 01:47:04
If you wanna put a condition that says. 01:47:06
The glow, uh, clay shooting as requested is approved. I think that's fine for clarification if you want to. 01:47:09
It was in the application. 01:47:15
And so you are approving what they're requesting. 01:47:18
With the conditions you've listed. 01:47:21
Yeah, additionally. 01:47:23
Staff proposed. 01:47:27
Allowing. 01:47:29
Environmental Expert. 01:47:30
To weigh in. 01:47:32
On the lead reclamation standard in their. 01:47:34
As as kind of a valve of whether it was truly necessary or not after the 10 years or 10,000 or 10 million shots or pH testings. 01:47:38
So I would ask that that. 01:47:47
Remain in there so that we're being led by science and not just the numbers. 01:47:48
I may have misheard it, yeah. 01:47:56
Yeah, just what you need to correct the first one. 01:47:58
I'm trying. Yeah, let me let him correct the first one. 01:48:02
OK. 01:48:16
What number was that in the staff report on the environmental? 01:48:18
Going back to the lead, correct, this is in regards to the lead reclamation, OK. 01:48:21
Yeah, what do you want? What do you say in the staff? 01:48:25
Right now it says you'll do. 01:48:30
10 years, 10 million rounds. 01:48:32
Or if you get outside the pH. 01:48:35
Here's the other part of the staff report. Required lead reclamation can be delayed if staff approved credential. 01:48:37
Is that what terrific I was just? 01:48:43
Wanting to add that. 01:48:45
If you would consider that. 01:48:47
I considered it when I I I mean I'll leave it up to the. 01:48:49
To see what some of my other board members think. 01:48:53
Very well, but. 01:48:55
I I left it out intentionally. 01:48:56
I'm good. 01:49:02
OK, good. 01:49:03
So the only thing I wanted. 01:49:06
I had one more. I had a. 01:49:08
We have a map. 01:49:09
And I want to mark on this map where you're talking about the tree buffer. 01:49:10
Wait, it goes. It goes from. 01:49:15
Right there. 01:49:17
Yes, Sir, where the existing tree canopy is behind the rally property, I'm going to put a. 01:49:18
Line right here, is that good? OK. 01:49:23
There's a pleasure goes around till you get to the easement. 01:49:26
So the utility wall. 01:49:30
Which is absolutely right here. 01:49:32
Wherever that. 01:49:34
Right here. 01:49:35
OK. 01:49:37
And man. 01:49:38
No, no, I would request you just because that's a double sided if you can X out in the back and I'm happy to do it on the backside 01:49:42
of that map so we're not attaching something extra. Oh yeah, there you go. Perfect. 01:49:47
Then let you mark it. 01:49:53
OK. 01:50:23
Got you. 01:50:27
All right, OK, so. 01:50:28
No, not at this point in time. We're on a ballot. 01:50:32
Okay. At this time we had an an amendment. 01:50:35
Amendment to the to the ballot. 01:50:39
I need a second on the amended ballot. 01:50:41
Any further discussion? 01:50:45
Being none, all in favor signify by aye. 01:50:47
Those opposed likewise. 01:50:50
All right. Thank you, guys. 01:50:52
Yeah, and I need, I need the second page signed along with the first page sign. Just put your initial, if you can initial the 01:50:55
bottom of each page of the ballot that does have a signature on it, correct? 01:51:01
We can do a motion to adjourn. 01:51:08
And I need a motion to adjourn. 01:51:10
I'll make a motion. I need a second. 01:51:12
I'll second got a second. All in favor signify by aye, thank you. 01:51:14