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Event transcript
It wasn't even. 00:00:08
OK. 00:00:19
All right, we're going to call the. 00:00:28
We have a meeting of the Floyd County Planning Commission September 8th. 00:00:31
At this time we'd like to and do the police pledge allegiance, please. 00:00:35
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. 00:00:39
And to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God. 00:00:43
Indivisible with liberty and justice for all. 00:00:47
All right. At this time we go for roll call for us please. 00:00:51
Here. 00:00:55
Here. 00:00:57
Here. 00:00:58
Here. 00:01:01
Here. 00:01:05
Here. 00:01:06
Here. 00:01:07
Here. All right, we got enough to have a meeting, so we're good to go. 00:01:09
We don't have any public here, so I guess they. 00:01:12
Really had to make a difference. 00:01:14
OK, this time we need a share by reviewed the minutes from the August 11th meeting. 00:01:16
This time I need a motion to approve those minutes. 00:01:21
I'll make a motion to approve. 00:01:26
The second place I got a. 00:01:28
2nd. 00:01:30
All in favor signify aye. 00:01:31
Aye, those opposed likewise. Thank you. 00:01:34
All right, old business. This is the agenda. 00:01:36
Number one. 00:01:39
FC-07-205-15. 00:01:41
Zoning ordinance amendment at this time, Ray, if you will. 00:01:45
Take it slow for us, please. 00:01:49
All right. Following our last meeting. 00:01:52
Draft today little presentation that just kind of gives an overview of our ordinance as well as the. 00:01:55
Reason we're here at this meeting today to. 00:02:01
Address, you know. 00:02:03
Provisions for. 00:02:05
These two amendments, food trucks and accessory dwelling units. 00:02:06
You all can see it on your screen. 00:02:10
No, I don't have my screen. 00:02:12
We don't have it on these. We got a mountaintop. 00:02:14
I guess you all probably just have to turn around. 00:02:20
OK. 00:02:22
Oh God, I can't turn around, Nicholas. 00:02:25
Whoa. Gonna go be the public. Yeah, I gotta be the public. I cannot. 00:02:28
That I can't do. 00:02:33
No, sorry, I can't see the left side well, we just need to put it in the slideshow view. 00:02:34
Do I really need it one more? 00:02:40
No over to slideshow if the top bar. 00:02:44
That bar, there you go. All right, so this is an overview of our zoning ordinance. 00:02:47
This first slide, so these are the sections of the ordinance. I just kind of summarized them because a lot of them were. 00:02:53
Very detailed and different aspects with. 00:03:00
Specific to what the ordinance they were. 00:03:04
Specifying so Section 1. Our our general provision Section 2. Our definition Section 3. 00:03:09
Non conforming structures, lots and uses. Section 4. Our development standards for zoning districts. Section 5 are general 00:03:15
standards. Section 6 are floodplain regulations. Section 7 are land unit development. 00:03:20
Language and Standards Section 8 or the Overlay Districts Section 9 is the Development review standards. 00:03:27
Section 10 is miscellaneous development standards. Section 11. Drainage and stormwater controls. Section 14. 00:03:33
Sexually oriented business purpose section 15 authority section 16 official zoning map in section 17 is the technical. 00:03:40
Review community and you might be wondering you know some stuff is missing. That's because they've either been. 00:03:49
Repealed or amended. So there are sections that are intentionally missing from there. 00:03:54
Moving on. 00:03:58
So what is the purpose of our zoning ordinance? The purpose of the Floyd County zoning? Zoning. 00:04:00
Sorry, zoning ordinance to regulate land use development. 00:04:04
In a way that promotes public health, safety and general welfare generally, the Orange serves to guide growth and development. 00:04:07
Preserve property values. Facilitate efficient use of amenities, utilities, public infrastructure. 00:04:13
In open space and carry out the goals of the Floyd County Comprehensive Plan and support the long term growth of the county. 00:04:18
What is the purpose of this meeting? 00:04:25
Purpose of this meeting is to discuss these proposed amendments. So why are we doing this? 00:04:27
Well, want to clarify gaps in our current ordinance. There are no Adu or food truck provisions in our ordinance currently. 00:04:32
Two, to add clear standards for food trucks and Adus. 00:04:38
3 to ensure consistency, fairness and enforceability. 00:04:41
Forward to address growing demands amongst many members and stakeholders. 00:04:45
5 to encourage development in Floyd County. 00:04:49
And six, there's a poor small, small, sorry, local small businesses and stimulate economic growth. 00:04:52
In the coming. 00:04:58
Now, this is specific to food trucks for why it is of importance and why we're choosing to. 00:05:01
I had a language for food trucks into our. 00:05:06
A current ordinance or into the. 00:05:09
So we want definitive standards to provide guidance to food truck owners to allow for general oversight and enforceability by our 00:05:11
office. 00:05:14
Standards outline pertain individuals who want to use a lot for permanent use. 00:05:17
Future standards outline primarily defer health and safety requirements to the appropriate governing body. 00:05:21
We don't want to be overly restrictive of food trips, we simply want to be able to have guidelines in place. 00:05:27
Primary reasons to include language in the ordinance Ensure food trucks operate in safe, accessible locations. 00:05:32
Address overnight parking storage to maintain neighborhood character. 00:05:37
Provide clear standards for parking. 00:05:40
Sanitation. 00:05:42
And he's these standards are to be located if you all remember. 00:05:44
Right here, section 10. 00:05:48
Under miscellaneous development standards and food trucks are to be added. 00:05:50
To the land use features. 00:05:54
Accessory dwelling units. So we've seen an increase in inquiries and applications pertaining to accessory dwelling units such as 00:05:58
Courage Homes. We actually just had a. 00:06:01
Item on the agenda. 00:06:05
Not too long, about an hour ago. 00:06:06
For carriage home. 00:06:08
Human occupancy is prohibited by the Floyd County zoning ordinance, so. 00:06:10
Homeowners want to incorporate ad use on a property have had to submit development standards Variance application. 00:06:14
Where the Board of Zoning Appeals stipulated the conditions. 00:06:18
We want to streamline this process by including provisions for Adus in the ordinance so that. 00:06:22
Development standard variants are only necessary if the applicant can't meet all. 00:06:26
Standards. 00:06:30
Primary reasons to include language in the floor county zoning ordinance are to provide standards and guidelines for community 00:06:31
members. 00:06:33
Provide affordable and flexible housing options for community members. 00:06:36
Direct development toward existing communities and provide and promote the efficient use of existing lots and infrastructures. 00:06:40
Or infrastructure. 00:06:46
These standards are to be included in. 00:06:47
Right there, Section 5 under general standards. 00:06:50
Under a subsection for Accessory uses structures. 00:06:54
So what are the next steps? 00:06:58
Review and discuss Adu and food truck standards provided by staff and make recommendations. Slash revisions to standards to 00:07:01
advance proposed amendments to county commissioners. 00:07:05
And include provisions neither the current. 00:07:09
Floyd County Zone Horns or the UDO to be released late this year, early next year. 00:07:11
So that's just kind of my quick little. 00:07:16
I say to you, tell me. 00:07:19
An ad use. Yeah, that's that's actually what I was going to go through. 00:07:23
Next. 00:07:26
OK, solidly. 00:07:39
Chris, take a seat. 00:07:41
So the way I kind of want to go through this is I want to go. 00:07:43
First over the definitions and go down each line item. 00:07:46
If anyone has any feedback, we'll just kind of discuss it. 00:07:52
Right then and there, so that way we're not just jumping all over. 00:07:55
Actually, Ray, why don't you go through? 00:08:01
The entire Adu. 00:08:03
Standards that were. 00:08:05
Suggesting. 00:08:07
Then we'll talk about those and then we'll move on. 00:08:08
Alright, so we'll start off with the definition. 00:08:13
Support Accessory Dwelling is a subordinate residential dwelling unit located on the same line as the principal single family 00:08:16
dwelling. 00:08:19
Adu provides complete independent living facilities for one or more persons and includes. 00:08:22
Permanent provisions for living, sleeping, eating, cooking and sanitation. 00:08:27
Maybe you must be detached from the principal dwelling. It must be clearly subordinate in size, location and function. 00:08:31
So going down. 00:08:36
The Accessory Dwelling Unit Standards section applies to the following districts. ARRSU&R, SO. 00:08:38
Item A and especially dwelling unit is considered an accessory structure slash. Use and should. 00:08:44
Sorry and shall comply with all development standards for subject zoning district. 00:08:49
Necessary dwelling shall meet the accessory. 00:08:53
Structured slash use standards for its applicable zoning district. 00:08:56
Item C An accessory building unit shall be permitted only in association with and on the same lot as the primary structure. 00:09:00
And must be consistent with the character. 00:09:06
Anesthetic of the primary structure. 00:09:08
Item D, an accessory dwelling unit, is not allowed on a lot prior to a primary structure being constructed. 00:09:10
Out of me, an accessory dwelling unit shall be secondary to the primary structure and height and square footage. 00:09:16
Item F No mobile home or manufacturing home may be using his accessory. 00:09:21
Item G uh. 00:09:25
Only one assessed renegade is permitted per parcel. 00:09:26
Item H. 00:09:29
Primary structure and accessory dwelling unit is located on. Must be owner occupied by. 00:09:31
Item I and accessory dueling unit must be connected to public water. 00:09:35
And sewer or September? 00:09:39
Jay has accessory dwelling. Any must include a separate entrance, sleeping area, dining area and bathroom facility as the primary 00:09:41
structure. 00:09:44
OK, home occupations are not permitted in an accessory. 00:09:48
Dwelling Unit. 00:09:51
In item L, an accessory dwelling unit intended to be used as a short term rental shall receive. 00:09:52
Approval as a conditional use. 00:09:57
So that those are the standards that we kind of looked through and thought would be appropriate for an accessory dwelling unit. 00:10:08
As as Ray was saying. 00:10:15
We do have these come up. 00:10:17
Somewhat frequently we get them asked about. 00:10:19
Pretty frequently. 00:10:22
At when they come to the BZA, we. 00:10:23
Often are approving them with conditions. 00:10:26
And so we were trying to. 00:10:29
Developed some standards. 00:10:30
To apply so that people that want to do have these ad use would not be required to come in and get special approvals. 00:10:32
If we're going to be approving them. 00:10:40
Consistently with certain conditions anyway. 00:10:42
So this is what we kind of had. 00:10:45
Developed. 00:10:47
And we wanted. 00:10:48
Feedback. What? What? You're all spot on. 00:10:50
Do we want to have these standards at all? 00:10:53
Do we want to just continue having them come through a special exceptions? 00:10:56
If not, which of these standards are appropriate? Do we want more? Do we want? 00:11:02
Something that we're not. 00:11:06
Saying you know 1. 00:11:08
That I look at here is we have it. So this would be an all residential districts. 00:11:11
I might consider, you know, only an AR and R districts where the property sizes are larger. 00:11:17
Might be a reasonable restriction, and then if if they wanted to do something in an Rs or an R, you'd still come in. 00:11:25
To kind of get approval so that we're not. 00:11:32
Crowding people. 00:11:35
More than we would. 00:11:36
Like. 00:11:40
I guess that's what we're we're looking for feedback here. I think ultimately what we're. 00:11:41
Probably going to do is. 00:11:46
As staff request to withdraw this recommendation and then just. 00:11:49
Pocketed for the Unified Development Code, but we want. 00:11:53
The plan Commission input on what that should ultimately be. I have a question for you. 00:11:59
On K home Occupy. 00:12:03
Occupations. 00:12:05
Are not so permitted in the dwelling so. 00:12:07
No occupation of business can be ran out of that dwell. 00:12:10
Correct. So currently they can. Now they're the personal home, yeah. 00:12:13
Currently, we have we allow home occupations so long as they meet certain standards to find in our ordinance. 00:12:17
And so this is just limiting it so that you. 00:12:25
Can't you know that's a little more intensive of abuse than what we were? 00:12:27
OK. So just to, I mean Larry and I both are on the BCA. We just had one of these come through. 00:12:32
In the meeting prior to this. 00:12:37
All of them that I've been involved for the past 10 years. 00:12:40
Probably been a half a dozen more. We've approved them all. 00:12:43
And I think they as the staff, they identified the things that we kind of. 00:12:46
Add to the the stipulation. So they've kind of caught that. 00:12:52
And over the years, that's that's what we see that the conditions we used to have make sure we. 00:12:56
We applied to or we applied to them. 00:13:02
So if that helps you as far as just to kind of look at it, I mean, I think it's nothing about. 00:13:04
I think y'all done a great job identifying what? 00:13:09
What the main issues are. So I think that's what he's wanting to just some. 00:13:12
Feedback on. 00:13:16
If you think this is enough for it's too much or whatever and do you agree with staff being able just to approve these so? 00:13:17
That's that's say that correctly. 00:13:23
Well, you're right. 00:13:27
We would not even need to. They would be by. 00:13:29
If so, meet these standards. 00:13:32
I know I did review the video in the minutes from last. I know there were some questions I. 00:13:35
I don't know that we answered all of them, so if those are still. 00:13:41
Lingering questions. 00:13:44
You know, please pose them again and I'll try to answer them. 00:13:46
I could. 00:13:50
Basically like Victor said, based on. 00:13:51
What we've done in the past. 00:13:54
In the in the very first part of it, it says one or more persons. Everything we've done to date is always seems to have been. 00:13:55
For our mother-in-law or father-in-law or somebody like that. 00:14:03
So. And I don't think you want to. 00:14:07
A family of 6 living in an Adu. So I'm thinking it ought to save one or two persons, not be. 00:14:09
One or more persons, I think they're. 00:14:16
And just to thought, my thought that went through my head. 00:14:18
Yeah, I think it becomes difficult to. 00:14:21
What about a mother and a baby? 00:14:25
You know what? You know, it gets difficult. I think that's where you where. 00:14:27
The idea is to. 00:14:31
Limit this. 00:14:33
The space and what? How much space they can have? What is required in it? 00:14:34
Well, we don't see anything about square footage here. 00:14:40
It's got to be smaller than the primary well, and that's where I have a couple of the Bourbon views, two different verbages from 00:14:43
the same thing and I think we need to use the same verbiage. So in the definition, use subordinate in size and location and 00:14:47
function. 00:14:51
But on E you say it shall be secondary to the primary, so I think you're both trying to say it so. 00:14:55
You're trying to say the same thing twice, and you need to use the same verbiage. 00:15:00
Yeah, consistent. 00:15:03
Yeah. 00:15:05
Yeah, we we can make that. 00:15:09
Distinction. 00:15:11
Yeah, it makes sense because because the standard helps. 00:15:15
Dictate that it is smaller because otherwise I say you need to use the word smaller because not everyone's got a Rick Fox sitting 00:15:18
right next to them when they're coming to you. 00:15:21
Well, and then if you're using two different words, the court's going to look at that and say, well, why did they do that? What 00:15:26
was their intent? 00:15:29
Right. Umm. 00:15:32
Yes, I got the approved lawyer that I was right when I looked at that. Yes, yes. 00:15:33
So I've got a question for those. You've been sitting here for a while and you said you've approved. 00:15:39
Half a dozen or a dozen of them. 00:15:44
So I have great concern about. 00:15:48
You know what happens later on down the road. 00:15:53
So I build a. 00:15:56
Smaller place. 00:15:58
Why don't my neighbors? 00:16:00
That have property. Why don't they complain and say well why didn't they subdivide that property? 00:16:02
And what happens with? 00:16:08
Moms passed away. 00:16:12
And we want to sell that. 00:16:14
Is there? 00:16:16
One driveway is there, two driveways is there. On the one we did, the one we approved tonight, we sent them. They couldn't have 00:16:17
subdivided off. 00:16:21
We totally couldn't do that. 00:16:25
Some we told them they couldn't rent it out either. 00:16:28
What do they do with it? 00:16:32
I mean. 00:16:34
Times gonna. 00:16:35
Time is my big question. I think I, I think you actually are hitting on one of the issues that we identify as that. 00:16:36
When we have been approving these for specific individual. 00:16:43
Well, that individual goes and then. 00:16:47
The structure is still there. 00:16:49
How are they going to reasonably use it? Someone else is going to, Yeah, I mean, that's my. And then it becomes a difficulty to. 00:16:54
To regulate that, to police that and someone did complain. 00:17:00
You know, how do we handle that? 00:17:04
So yes, that that's one of the reasons why we wanted to kind of. 00:17:06
That's one of my concerns is what happens down the road. My other concern that. 00:17:10
I've checked with the health department and said wait a minute, what about septic? 00:17:16
Because. 00:17:20
You know you're tapping into. Well, Monday night we told them they had to get. 00:17:21
They had to get approval from the health department to be able to add the bathroom and stuff. 00:17:25
So when you go build the place, they say how many bathrooms you gonna have and how many people have lived there, and then they 00:17:29
tell you what kind of septic you're gonna have. 00:17:34
Well, now five years goes by or 10 years goes by. 00:17:38
We don't even know what the septic looks like. 00:17:42
But uh. 00:17:45
Now we're saying, yeah, go ahead and tap into that. That kind of counterproductive, The health department would still have to 00:17:45
approve. 00:17:49
That additional dwelling unit, this additional accessory structure we actually have that it must connect to sewer septic and in 00:17:53
the health department. You're right when they. 00:17:58
Make their initial approval. It's based on how many bedrooms you have in there. 00:18:03
But they they can go out and. 00:18:09
Add additional a lot of Sept. 00:18:11
Have more capacity than what they are initially. 00:18:13
Dealt with, but that would be a requirement that they are on an adequate septic system. 00:18:17
You're open up. I mean to your point, we and everyone that we approved. 00:18:23
Everyone of them when they come up in front of us. 00:18:27
The guy this tonight said, you know, I, you know, I can't think about, even think about putting my mother-in-law in a nursing 00:18:30
home. 00:18:33
You know they give us the. 00:18:37
The story OK, which is. 00:18:38
True. OK. 00:18:40
And then? 00:18:42
Everyone. I'm had that. That's the same story you have. 00:18:42
Everyone of them, it's either for a mother-in-law or an elderly person or something of that nature, and every time we've approved 00:18:45
it. 00:18:49
We sit and talk about the same thing. 00:18:53
What's going to happen when that? 00:18:55
Person dies. 00:18:56
And that becomes empty. 00:18:58
Well, more likely without us knowing. 00:19:01
They're probably going to rent it. 00:19:04
I mean, you know. 00:19:06
So they're probably gonna find some iron tape. 00:19:07
It hopefully it's a relative but. 00:19:10
There's no guarantee it is, but. 00:19:12
I don't know how you police it so. 00:19:14
You'd either have to say. 00:19:16
Were never proven 1. 00:19:17
And that's the only way you can control it. 00:19:20
I don't know either way you could. 00:19:23
Because if you stipulate that if that person leaves. 00:19:24
And if anybody else other than the original intended person. 00:19:28
Is no longer occupying that structure. 00:19:32
We shall be notified. 00:19:35
Whoo, I don't know that's. 00:19:37
It's a thought, right? 00:19:38
No, I'm, I'm at the point where you said you've approved 10 or 12. I want to go by the addresses and see what's going on. 00:19:41
1/2 a dozen. Stop stretching, Frank. 00:19:47
So I mean, that's kind of where I'm at is I want, I'd like to see what's going on. I'd like to see the structure that they put up. 00:19:49
And you don't have to go very far from here and there's a bunch of mini ohms. 00:19:57
Sitting in backyards and what I remember, a little bit bigger than a Playhouse, you know? 00:20:01
We put one out on Corn Ridge Rd. I remember that. You remember that one that was in the back. 00:20:07
The one tonight you approved. 00:20:12
Is on. 00:20:13
Office, Scottsville Rd. Run. 00:20:15
So anyway, to your point, I don't know how you police it. 00:20:18
And I don't know what you do unless you put a condition. 00:20:21
As I said. 00:20:24
If that is no longer occupied by the original intended person. 00:20:25
Then you need to get additional approval. 00:20:30
Well then. 00:20:32
Are we opening ourselves up for? 00:20:36
A issue down the road? 00:20:39
You. That would be something either way. 00:20:41
That would. 00:20:44
Yeah, that would not be something that the county wants to get involved. 00:20:44
Policing. No, no, I'm talking about. 00:20:49
If they if the stipulations were put on there and then those people. 00:20:52
Don't abide by the stipulations. 00:20:57
I mean, I don't know what happens. 00:21:00
Well, the only thing is, if someone complained, we would investigate it and we would determine if it's. 00:21:02
That individual that's supposed to be there and that we would write them a note of violation if it wasn't. So yes, we would get 00:21:08
involved in policing that situation. And if we don't want to, the only other way you could do that is if you say every year they 00:21:12
have to, they have to. 00:21:17
So they have to sign in. 00:21:22
Or they have to send to the county. 00:21:24
That the. 00:21:26
The the. 00:21:27
Structures being occupied for 10 games every year. They gotta send that in. 00:21:29
Well then at some point. 00:21:33
They're either. They're either Lion. 00:21:35
Or if they didn't send it in, then at that point we could have a checklist that we call them up and say why didn't you send it 00:21:38
this? 00:21:41
So then the other. 00:21:44
The real estate question is. 00:21:45
Is that? 00:21:48
Well, I guess there's more than that because. 00:21:49
How are we taxing that? 00:21:52
The assessor's goods out there and is it 2 houses or one? 00:21:54
I I don't know how the assessors would look at that. It's, it's a secondary structure. It's kind of like a, a garage or. 00:21:58
Something of that nature I think they would do, except for a lot more. 00:22:05
Huh. Except for a lot. Well, yeah, but. 00:22:09
This was but once again. 00:22:11
Every time we've approved one, it's always been a hardship. 00:22:14
Situation. So I mean it's. 00:22:17
You know, you're sitting here in front of the board, in public, in the whole 9 yards, this guy saying, you know, my 00:22:19
mother-in-law's meant to go in a nursing home. 00:22:22
We don't have room in the house. 00:22:26
You know I asked the question tonight. 00:22:28
That the the bedroom is going to be on 2nd floor and I said. 00:22:30
If you put an elevator. 00:22:33
He said no, but we're putting a lift in. OK, Well, he. 00:22:35
A chair, stairway, lift or something like that. But at least he had a right answer. 00:22:37
He didn't say. 00:22:41
We're not putting anything in them. They're not have to question. 00:22:42
The intent, you know what I'm saying? You're putting your mile on the 2nd floor and you're worried about her. 00:22:45
Nursing home. 00:22:49
So, you know, so so those ones that. 00:22:50
That you guys have approved so far, What kind of acreage? 00:22:52
Have you been, I mean, what size lots are these things going on now? 00:22:56
That one actually was. 00:22:59
What was it for? 00:23:00
War acre lot. 00:23:02
So about two acre lot on that which is about our AR. 00:23:05
Our largest lot standard. 00:23:09
Typically they are in rural residential AR districts, so typically our larger lots typically. 00:23:11
Kind of out. 00:23:17
Play. So would you not? I mean, you mentioned looking at. 00:23:19
Anchorage, I guess, or size of the lot. 00:23:24
Versus the size of the building, would you do a percentage of? 00:23:27
The main structure to the secondary structure would that's. 00:23:30
You know, would that simplify it more? 00:23:34
I think if you want, if you were concerned, you could do a minimum square footage. We have minimum square footage for primary 00:23:37
structures. 00:23:40
Yeah, but well, more of a maximum. 50 is our minimum. 00:23:44
And uh. 00:23:49
But you still want it. You do. You definitely would want it to be subordinate to the. 00:23:50
Primary structure. 00:23:54
Because then you're then you're in the multifamily. You're basically going to be multifamily if they wrote. 00:23:57
The one, the one tonight was 3/4 of an acre, Yeah. 00:24:02
Is what it was in Fox Hill states. 00:24:05
And real nice house on the right and the structure he's going to build. 00:24:07
It's going to be. 00:24:11
Behind the original. 00:24:12
Front building line of the house that's already there. 00:24:14
Then he's what he's doing is going to be. 00:24:17
It's going to be an attractability. It's a garage on the lower level. 00:24:19
So he is thinking ahead somewhat there, you know, in other words. 00:24:22
Whatever, the upstairs is not going to be needed. 00:24:26
He's got a garage. He's. 00:24:29
There's a purpose for it. No, I get it. Other than that, you understand what I'm saying. So. 00:24:31
I mean, I think. 00:24:35
Once again sitting in my seat. 00:24:36
You think I take a ******** saying we're not going to ever approve one? 00:24:38
Which? 00:24:42
I don't know if anybody agrees with that then if you do approve it then. 00:24:43
They've come up with the guidelines we've obviously. 00:24:46
Or being asked to add to it. 00:24:49
And so that's, yeah, whatever. At least you get a start. 00:24:51
Yeah, that's what we're saying. 00:24:56
Definitely. 00:24:58
In BZA, the Planning Commission is still going to. 00:25:00
Be looking. 00:25:03
Blanketed well, one of the key things I think is the use of the property is not substantially different by adding an accessory 00:25:05
dwelling unit. 00:25:09
Still still a residential. 00:25:15
Residential essentially a single. 00:25:18
You could have a secondary, but it would be subordinate, so it would be, you know, one or two other people living in. 00:25:21
You could have the same problem of. 00:25:27
You know we have. 00:25:29
Five people live in in one room in a single family house. 00:25:31
And people coming in and going like that, same issue. 00:25:36
I know where those addresses are. 00:25:39
But that same issue would be. 00:25:43
That is a concern with Adus is this. 00:25:45
Concern with single family houses it's not. 00:25:48
So I quit, I questioned. And Rick this question for you. 00:25:50
Is that? 00:25:53
You know some people. 00:25:54
If they had to sign some type of affidavit that says. 00:25:56
I hereby. 00:25:59
Verify that under. 00:26:01
Whatever oath or whatever that I will not. 00:26:02
Use this dwelling other than what the intent I've been I'll get approved for. 00:26:05
And you know, they sign it. I mean, some people, just the fact that they sign. 00:26:11
Some saying they will not do it. 00:26:15
There's, you know, the majority of people are honest. 00:26:17
OK, so I mean there are some that aren't, but at least. 00:26:20
In their mind, they've signed something that said. 00:26:23
I will not use it for anything of the intent. 00:26:26
But what do you do with that affidavit when the property owner? 00:26:28
Vacates. 00:26:31
Sells it. 00:26:32
That he has to answer whether it goes with the deed. 00:26:34
Whether it's part of the deed, can they subdivide it at that point? 00:26:36
You would only be able to subdivide it if. 00:26:40
It met. 00:26:43
The standards. 00:26:44
Of a normal. 00:26:46
It would still need to meet all the other standards. If they're kind into the septic system, then they got a problem. 00:26:48
Right. You gotta have separate that's why they would have to buy. So they would probably they they could try, yeah. 00:26:55
So I guess that would be illegal non conforming. 00:27:02
I guess my big question is. 00:27:05
Are we considering this to make it easier for? 00:27:07
Or are we considering this because? 00:27:12
The BCA doesn't want to make the decision or why don't we just keep it the way it is, which is a total it's a possibility. We 00:27:16
absolutely can. I'm not against it was if we're approving these. 00:27:22
Repeatedly. 00:27:29
With basically the same standards. 00:27:30
Why are we asking people? 00:27:32
To pay $300, have a public hearing, do the whole thing. 00:27:34
If if it's basically. 00:27:39
Well, he said, he's only listened to six of them. 00:27:43
Right. I get that right. 6-6 of them in 10 years. So I don't know that it's worth. 00:27:46
But I mean, I don't think it's an over. It's not overly burdened staff to do this. 00:27:55
The thought was we're always having to say it's, it's, it's, it's kind of a rubber stamp when you come through where. 00:28:00
If it's for this, this and this. 00:28:08
These are the conditions it gets approved. 00:28:10
Why are we asking property owners? 00:28:12
To pay all this extra to go through this process. 00:28:14
If it's. 00:28:18
Going to be approved anyway. 00:28:20
See, I feel better. 00:28:22
Not coming from the BCA. 00:28:23
If they had to sign after. 00:28:25
That I mean to me I just. 00:28:27
You know. 00:28:29
To me, I'd feel more comfortable with that than what we're going through, I think. 00:28:30
And Mr. Luke? 00:28:33
This would only. 00:28:36
When it the time comes, whatever provisions we put in here will come to the commissioners for their decision on it as well. It's 00:28:38
just recommendation. Is it? 00:28:42
But at least gives guidelines. 00:28:47
Yeah, in, in. 00:28:49
Reference to an index. 00:28:50
To go compared to what? 00:28:53
You know, I don't want to give the impression that. 00:28:55
Staff is neither for or against this. This is what we are. You know, this comes up. We're just. 00:29:00
You know, this is for you all to decide whether you want to. I think it's needed. 00:29:06
I like it. One other thing that kind of addresses like, OK, we've got a shared driveway, whatever. How are we, how are emergency 00:29:10
personnel distinguishing if? 00:29:14
Going to. 00:29:18
100 Scottsville Rd. 00:29:20
House A or House B in an emergency situation. 00:29:21
How are we distinguishing that? 00:29:25
How would that be? Well, the post office has to give an address if. 00:29:29
That had their own address, OK. 00:29:35
Again, so it could be like the A or B, it's going to be an address, it's going to be 7 address. Could it be like 3806 A and? 00:29:38
They're separate. I don't know about. 00:29:50
All that well and address this company, give us a separate address. 00:29:54
I think that would you guys see? 00:29:58
I tell the post office, well it's not a problem with 911 as long as they have an address. But if that's supposed to be a relative. 00:30:04
Hopefully they're. 00:30:11
They're the ones that are opening the door for us. Well, I was thinking of OK if. 00:30:12
Primary residence people are home. 00:30:16
Mother-in-law's home has a heart attack or whatever and is calling and no one else is. 00:30:18
Well, they check all the. 00:30:22
Structures again, yeah. 00:30:24
Just fire EMS, please check all the structures. 00:30:25
I don't. 00:30:29
Somebody called from there. 00:30:30
Maybe. 00:30:32
OK, so. 00:30:38
Just to kind of almost play devil's advocate. 00:30:39
You know, umm. 00:30:42
On the four side of ad use, I see more AD use going on in like the city on smaller lots. 00:30:43
With people trying to offset, you know, with rentals. 00:30:48
And I think that's great. You know, the housing. 00:30:52
You know, affordable housing. 00:30:54
You can do this. 00:30:55
You know, out in the county. 00:30:56
I see where it may not be looked at that way, where you're doing it actually for your for your in laws. 00:30:58
You know, and I don't know if it's necessarily to create a rental situation. I think there's a good safeguard in there. Letter H, 00:31:03
you know, it has to be owner occupied. 00:31:07
You know, most, most real estate investors who are just buying the property gonna slap an Adu. They can't do it. They just won't 00:31:11
do it because they don't live there. 00:31:15
So I think that's a good safeguard. 00:31:18
You know, I appreciate that, yeah. 00:31:20
So I think H is good if we, you know, if we want to go that route. 00:31:23
But I think that that's a good protection. 00:31:26
On just creating a bunch of multifamily. 00:31:29
On on lots and really when you get down the road. 00:31:31
It seems like just letting the cards fall as it may in terms of. 00:31:36
Not having the police, all of that of. 00:31:40
I mean, it puts a strain on government. 00:31:43
In terms of having the police. 00:31:45
You know, typically if you're going to go to court, then you have. 00:31:51
Pork cost and all that stuff associated with it and it's. 00:31:55
It's it's just a drain on local government. I see that and every time we pass something. 00:31:59
And you got to police it. 00:32:04
Yep. 00:32:05
OK then. 00:32:09
So. 00:32:10
Rick, what are you saying then don't don't have guidelines? No, no. 00:32:11
This is perfectly fine. 00:32:15
The affidavit part, yeah. 00:32:17
Don't do that just. 00:32:19
You know, it was, it was a great purpose when it was done. 00:32:21
And then let the new owners take care of it. 00:32:24
The way they're going to take. 00:32:27
And so, you know, I think there's there's a market out there far. 00:32:29
You know, families that do have, you know, they may be looking specifically for that type thing. 00:32:35
Mother-in-law or father-in-law, little house. And so that's detached. Yeah. And you're gonna get some of that anyway if you get 00:32:40
somebody that rents it. 00:32:44
Let him do it. 00:32:48
It's just it's difficult to police and. 00:32:50
It to me it's a waste of money for government. 00:32:55
To police. 00:32:57
And just as property owners. 00:32:59
You know, like I said, what? 00:33:04
Let the property owners make. 00:33:06
Make those decisions? Well, it's their property. Tell them what they can and can't do. 00:33:08
Is somewhat fine, so expand expand a little bit on that as far as. 00:33:13
Do you think this should be put? 00:33:19
Into I do staff. 00:33:21
I do, I think because it gives it. 00:33:24
I you know if I was. 00:33:26
Republican, you know, I have land if I wanted to do something like this. 00:33:29
At least I have some guidelines. 00:33:32
Instead of being. 00:33:35
Wide open. 00:33:36
And it does restrict, I mean when it goes to. 00:33:38
BZA, there's other members there. 00:33:42
You know they switch. 00:33:46
Every other year? What? Whatever. 00:33:47
Other part. 00:33:50
At least you get a guideline of what what's there. 00:33:50
And you go from there. I, I know I would like, like to have a guideline. 00:33:53
Of some time. 00:33:59
In the way you've got it indexed too. 00:34:01
Compared to what? 00:34:03
Been working on for a couple years on the. 00:34:05
The master plan. 00:34:07
You know, it makes it a lot easier in it. 00:34:09
Floyd County's already. 00:34:13
Tough enough. 00:34:14
To get stuff approved. 00:34:15
This at least. 00:34:18
Having guidelines makes it a little bit more user friendly. 00:34:20
At least half and. 00:34:23
Right, so we got guidelines. 00:34:24
So back to the I mean, we can't, I mean, we've got enough people here have a straw ball. It doesn't mean anything. 00:34:26
How many people thinks it needs to stay? 00:34:33
At the BZA level. 00:34:35
I would personally. 00:34:38
Think thinking with two hats here 1 is a. 00:34:39
Say the consumer owner of the property. 00:34:44
I wouldn't want to go in front of the BZL all the time. 00:34:47
So show, show. I mean, it's not a vote, but show. 00:34:49
Who thinks it should stay in the BCA versus it should? 00:34:53
The guidelines should be passed on. 00:34:56
I think the guidelines should be passed on personally. 00:34:58
I like the guidelines, but I think Frank brings up some good points about the septics and you know, I think though, that kind of 00:35:01
needs to be ironed out more. 00:35:04
That's taken care of it. That's that. That is well, you got to get approval. 00:35:07
One thing I guess either I wasn't clear, didn't get asked. 00:35:13
Let's say I've got 5 acres. 00:35:20
And I want to put 2 Adus. 00:35:22
Yeah, you you can't do too. 00:35:25
Why not? Because, uh. 00:35:27
It says no. And here it does say that there's only one. It says that there's only one. 00:35:29
Under item. 00:35:35
It's only one. 00:35:37
100 foot Rd. frontage if it had the square footage. 00:35:40
For a lot. Am I saying that correct? 00:35:44
Well, that's just going to be another house if you're going to divide it off. Yeah, be just building. That's that's the way they 00:35:47
could do. 00:35:50
But it have to be done or it has to be done or 50 square feet. 00:35:54
Correct. Yeah, yeah. 00:35:58
To be able to. 00:35:59
You all remember anything else? 00:36:02
Of Buff Creek Rd. Plague. 00:36:04
Didn't they build 1? 00:36:07
Carry large carriage house. 00:36:08
Doubt no. Do you remember anything Victor played Buck Creek Rd. There was one that he built a barn. 00:36:12
Out front. 00:36:18
The only thing I remember, yeah, that's why he built a barn out front of his house. 00:36:20
We allowed that, you know. 00:36:23
Hey, that's not bad for an old guy. 00:36:26
Ray, I guess. 00:36:28
From what I just got a couple of comments, I'm not sure what we're singing, we're singing. 00:36:32
There's nothing in here right now that says it has to be a relative. 00:36:38
And I don't know if that's what we're wanting. 00:36:41
Should it say that the person has to be a relative of the? 00:36:43
Of the property. Well, if we're not gonna have an affidavit, then it's kind of hard. We won't do it after. Yeah, it's gonna be 00:36:46
hard to kind of police. 00:36:50
Are, you know, how are we going to be able to enforce that their relatives were not at that point, it's like, well, take, take it 00:36:54
a step further, maybe not an affidavit. 00:36:57
But when they come in for the. 00:37:01
Permit just have it on the permit where they say I hereby certify. 00:37:03
I hereby state that. 00:37:09
This is being used and whatever you want to put. 00:37:10
At least they sign it. OK, Not an affidavit, just. 00:37:13
At least the person knows. 00:37:16
You know, can't say, well, I didn't understand. I couldn't do that. 00:37:18
Well, you signed that. You said you could do it. 00:37:21
You know when somebody said, I think that's one of the issues we have. 00:37:23
I have at least is. 00:37:26
Is restricting these to to relatives. 00:37:28
Is is a short term? 00:37:31
2 needs down the line, but that building is going to be there. 00:37:36
For, that's what I use. For I don't. I don't know how you do. 00:37:41
That was a question. I wasn't making a. 00:37:45
That's why we've never I can see. 00:37:47
I mean it is. It is called an accessory dwelling unit. 00:37:50
And you have a guest, so I want to be your son. 00:37:53
I want to build it. 00:37:55
I've known people, they've called and said, hey, I, you know, I wanna. 00:37:56
My son's coming back from. 00:38:00
University and. 00:38:02
He doesn't want to live in the house, he wants his own living quarters, so for saying. 00:38:03
You know the mother-in-law or widowed, you know. 00:38:07
Whatever, uh. 00:38:10
It's going to be hard to kind of be able to, you know? 00:38:11
Police that if we're just saying, oh, it has to be just this kind of family member as opposed, OK, somebody calls you and they 00:38:14
said their kids coming back from college and they don't want to live at home. They need to get their own place and a job. 00:38:19
I mean it's. 00:38:27
OK. 00:38:30
On age. 00:38:34
I understand it's supposed to be. 00:38:35
Primary structure. 00:38:37
Owner occupied. I think it needs. 00:38:39
I don't think it's very clear the way it's currently written. 00:38:42
I would rewrite that a little bit. 00:38:45
The primary structure where the accessory journal. 00:38:47
Unit is located, must be owner occupied. I'd reward that so. 00:38:50
A little more clear. 00:38:55
OK. And then on item? 00:38:57
I think I would add. 00:39:00
Where I got sewer and septic tank that that requires Ford County Health Department approval. I would add that. 00:39:01
In item J since it's a separate structure. 00:39:08
I don't think you need to. I think it's redundant to say. 00:39:11
Separate entrance. 00:39:14
It won't have we had it, you said. 00:39:16
Could be attached. Yeah, that's where I removed that language. You probably need to remove the word entrance off of J. 00:39:18
And I'll shut up. 00:39:24
Well, if it's it. 00:39:26
If it's attached, it's not a separate. It's it's not, it's not just a renovation, yes. 00:39:27
Yeah, that's what we clarified, yes. 00:39:34
I do think that brings up and it was mentioned a couple times. 00:39:42
I think we probably do want to add some language. 00:39:46
Regarding that. 00:39:50
The driveway, I think we want a single driveway. We don't. 00:39:51
1 addition is being. 00:39:55
Added for these. 00:39:59
That's good. Good catch. 00:40:01
And we decided to. 00:40:03
That the primary residence had to be owner occupied. 00:40:04
So we didn't have a bunch of people coming in just buy a house and build another one. 00:40:08
Next to it. 00:40:12
OK. 00:40:14
I'm a little bit. 00:40:18
More comfortable than the last time we met. 00:40:19
Well, well, you've got. 00:40:25
More exposure to. 00:40:26
The the lower ask yourself. 00:40:31
Watch yourself of those that don't follow the rules. 00:40:34
Thank you. 00:40:44
So we have a couple edits to make here. 00:40:49
Do we want to? 00:40:56
Table is for. 00:40:59
With revision. 00:41:00
And bring it back for recommendation. 00:41:02
Or would you all prefer we just? 00:41:05
Fall back and update it with the the UDL update. 00:41:07
I don't have the Unified Development ordinance. 00:41:13
Putting the subdivision control ordinance. 00:41:16
And the zoning ordinance together. 00:41:19
With Ray here, we've actually been able to progress that again. So we hope we. 00:41:22
He had a timeline. 00:41:27
With this view, with this few of these as we have, I would just say put it in with the big change, yeah. 00:41:28
Not make it a separate thing. 00:41:34
So. 00:41:36
And that comes for the commissioners anyhow, Yeah. 00:41:37
Yeah, I just do that too. So with that, staff's going to request that we withdraw that. 00:41:40
OK, so do we need a motion for that? I make a motion to withdraw accessory dwelling unit. 00:41:46
Standards from. 00:41:51
All right, so I got a second. All in favor say aye. 00:41:55
Those opposed likewise. 00:42:01
There you go. So let it be put in with you. Need something filled out? We're still going to do food truck, right? Yeah, we're 00:42:03
still going to do food truck. But do you need anything side to fill out? 00:42:07
No, OK. 00:42:12
Gotcha. The record sufficient, but we got new food trucks. You're making me hungry. Stop talking about. 00:42:14
At the last meeting I brought up the amendments. You wanted to add a. 00:42:22
To the ordinance pertaining to provisions for food trucks similar to the. 00:42:26
Since we're dueling units, I'm going to just go over the definition and then. 00:42:32
Go down the items and then. 00:42:35
We'll discuss after work. So food trucks are self-propelled, fully licensed motor vehicle and movable trailer design and equip to 00:42:36
prepare, cook. 00:42:40
Served for Sofia and or beverages. 00:42:44
To the public. 00:42:47
Food truck may not be permanently fixed any location or connected to permanent water. 00:42:48
Sewer or electrical systems. 00:42:53
The Future Standards sections apply to the following districts. 00:42:56
And CGCHS OB. 00:42:59
And GI item a food trucks must apply with. 00:43:01
Applicable state and local food safety guidelines regulations, as well as applicable Indiana State codes. 00:43:05
Regulating mobile food establishments. 00:43:10
Item B Food trucks. 00:43:13
Must be located on a lot with an established structure. Use. 00:43:15
Item C Food trucks shall not be parked overnight at the site or location from which they operate. 00:43:18
Unless fully screened from the view of the right of way. 00:43:23
In a or in a completely closed building. 00:43:25
Item D Food trucks must have access to and from the. 00:43:28
Which they will be located via a driveway which must be paved. 00:43:31
Item E Food trucks must remain operable and mobile at all times and not they shall not be permanently connected to utilities, 00:43:35
foundations, or other structures. 00:43:39
Item F Food trucks must not block driveways, fire lanes, sidewalks or accessible parking. 00:43:44
Spaces Item G Food truck lighting must be shielded and fixed downward. Item H Food trucks shall not operate in any right of way. 00:43:49
Item I Food trucks operating as part of a county permitted event. 00:43:57
Are exempt from the above. Stamina's must, must. I'm sorry. 00:44:01
But must still meet all local and state. 00:44:04
Food safety guidelines, regulations as well as all applicable Indiana code. 00:44:07
Joe, the only thing I'd like to add. 00:44:12
I don't know how we say it, but some or another we they need to be. 00:44:16
Understandable for the public. 00:44:20
Getting to and from the truck. 00:44:23
In other words, they don't put a truck out in the parking lot. 00:44:25
And where people are crossing lane of traffic or so. 00:44:28
They need to put some kind of safety measures, either cones. 00:44:31
Are are a designated walkway or whatever? 00:44:34
Because they're going to change the. 00:44:37
You know when they put that foot truck in? 00:44:39
It wasn't considered in the. 00:44:40
The building or the drive or all that stuff. So I don't know how you say that, but just, well, I don't think. 00:44:43
A. They would have to have the commissioners approval to make any changes to a County Road. No, I don't mean that. I don't mean 00:44:52
that or a state Rd. 00:44:56
No, I don't mean that either. I'm saying in a party, put it put. 00:45:00
Cones, you know, they don't walk across the street. 00:45:02
Yes, I'm saying if they, you know, they put up food trucks sticking them in a parking lot. 00:45:06
Take Highlander Point. 00:45:11
You know, you got the, you got the main drive through there, you put a food truck and somebody wants. 00:45:13
Somebody's going to walk out in front of a car or whatever to get to the thing. I mean, it's not a crosswalk. It's. 00:45:16
I mean we the parking lot parking lots don't have. 00:45:23
Crosswalks. I mean, I work in a building that doesn't have. So I'm just saying that it needs to be taken into consideration. 00:45:27
That's all I'm saying. I mean. 00:45:30
Give me an example. 00:45:33
Because in my head I'm thinking like, if you look like a gas station, you have been a gas station. I usually have those food 00:45:35
trucks up like. 00:45:38
No near the you know. 00:45:41
Sometimes near the gas station and. 00:45:43
You just park and then you go. I actually was down on Friday so. 00:45:46
There wouldn't necessarily need to be like a walkway or anything, as you know it's already located on a lot. Just put it. They 00:45:49
need to take into consideration safety to the. 00:45:53
Today, yeah, you gotta worry about the to the pedestrian traffic getting to and from it. 00:45:57
But to be operated unless it's fully screened to the view of the right way, one is the. 00:46:02
Like there's one in. 00:46:08
I can on Grantland Road it. 00:46:09
Right. Well, I don't. 00:46:13
You speak the unemployment office. I can't. 00:46:16
Right across from there. 00:46:18
And we've covered our **** from the standpoint from the county. We've told them to address it. 00:46:19
It's in there. 00:46:23
How they do it, it's up to them. They need to be safe. 00:46:25
I mean, I think you're trying to learn some of these things. You're asking, would you just, would you just add? 00:46:28
You know that. 00:46:33
They would have available parking. 00:46:34
For that food drug, because I think that's. 00:46:36
Kind of what you're saying. You can't. I'm just saying that in general they agree. Yeah, I just put it in someplace where nobody 00:46:38
got a place to park. They got to park on this for temporary. This is for if they're playing. 00:46:44
But they're always going to be going back to that. This is where we're having hiccups at Permanent. 00:46:51
So no, it can't stay. 00:46:59
They can't stay overnight, so the idea of putting together some language here. 00:47:01
We've had a couple. 00:47:07
Different folks come in and want to do a food truck on a baking pot. 00:47:09
And denied them those times. 00:47:13
I don't know if they even came in for the the other one but recently we denied them. 00:47:18
Kind of and the realization came that. 00:47:22
If a food truck was operating. 00:47:25
Anywhere else it went parked in a parking lot and was operating. 00:47:28
Do we want to prohibit them? 00:47:34
To to be there because. 00:47:36
The way we are looking at it is that is a separate use and we have to have a special exception for that to prevent them from being 00:47:38
vacant permanently. 00:47:42
So we were like, well, I don't think we want to prohibit food trucks in the county. 00:47:47
We just don't want them to be able to use a vacant lot. 00:47:53
As a. 00:47:57
A place of. 00:47:59
Operation because it doesn't have. 00:48:00
Necessary Parking necessary. 00:48:02
Amenities. 00:48:05
To to accommodate that. 00:48:07
So the idea was. 00:48:08
How do we put standards together? 00:48:11
That will allow food trucks to operate in a Safeway in the county. 00:48:13
Without having them. 00:48:17
Them having to get special permits, special exceptions. 00:48:19
And if it's a situation where they would need that if they come to a vacant lot, then they would have to. 00:48:23
OK, I think you just I. 00:48:28
I think I can help all of us out, so I. 00:48:30
In our definition. 00:48:33
We need more. 00:48:34
To say this is for. 00:48:35
You know. 00:48:37
Vacant lot use whatever because when I look at this. 00:48:38
And you say that we are only doing this in NC, GCHS, OB and GI. 00:48:41
We're prohibiting them from doing business at graduation parties and stuff that are on public. 00:48:45
So somewhere, no, actually this is they're within those. 00:48:50
So these are all commercial districts that these standards apply to. We have no standards for. 00:48:55
Residential district, so we could need neither. 00:49:01
So. But looking at this as a layperson, I think it reads up. 00:49:05
Oh you're telling me I can only operate my food truck in these and I can't do private rentals and go to a subdivision? 00:49:08
For a block party. 00:49:16
Or a fun or a fund. 00:49:17
Like, well, actually, yeah, you, you would not be if, if it's on someone's private residence, you could. 00:49:20
How about if it's on the on the drive, in the in the street, Yeah. 00:49:26
You could come and get a temporary use. It's not. It's not. It's on private property. 00:49:31
And yeah, it's. 00:49:36
They don't. 00:49:38
They don't have to have a permit. 00:49:38
On private property. 00:49:40
Correct. 00:49:42
Yeah, well the commercial they did, they would need a temporary use perm. 00:49:44
But you're at. 00:49:52
When we ask them. 00:49:53
The OP if they leave it overnight it has to be fully. 00:49:55
Screen from the view of the right away I've. 00:49:59
Like it's, yeah. So I think the idea of what behind that one was that. 00:50:01
So. 00:50:06
It's a not permit to a non permanent use of the site. 00:50:08
So you couldn't park it? 00:50:13
You couldn't park your truck on someone's property, or I mean. 00:50:15
On a commercial lot. 00:50:19
And just leave it there full time. Full time. 00:50:21
You couldn't leave it sit behind the JC all the time. So do we. 00:50:24
But you can leave it overnight. 00:50:28
OK, Do we? 00:50:30
Does Greenville have their own planning and. 00:50:34
We we are there planning and zoning. We contract for them because that trailer hasn't moved in two years. 00:50:36
Which one? The food truck trailer that did the old mini mall. 00:50:42
Katrina. It's like related to LA Katrina. 00:50:46
It's down there. I haven't moved. 00:50:49
They get done closed up. 00:50:51
It sits there. 00:50:53
So that would be something that we would be able to regulate. 00:50:55
Given this provision, but you're saying right now we can't right now? 00:50:59
Oh, OK, so they're not in violation for anybody listening they're but see. 00:51:03
You got to put a Max in there, don't yours. It covered someplace else, it says. 00:51:09
No night parking, less screened and less fully screened. 00:51:13
How many days can they leave it there fully screened? 00:51:17
If it's fully screened then there's no issue. It's not. 00:51:20
Then they got to take it off. That's it. 00:51:23
As a business owner, that would not be feasible. 00:51:25
Why would I want to come So the one he was just talking about his screen that could stay there. 00:51:28
Yeah. 00:51:32
But if it was screened you would. 00:51:34
It's like having it in a garage. 00:51:37
What's the definition of screen? 00:51:39
Yeah. 00:51:42
I think we were looking to just. 00:51:49
Not create the situation where a truck is parked there permanently and it kind of becomes an eyesore. I can think of one in the 00:51:55
city that's been there for. 00:52:00
Four or five years never moved and. 00:52:05
It's permanently hooked up to the building, but that's in the city. I understand that. I think one of the and I would want to get 00:52:08
to that. 00:52:11
Is we want brick and mortar? 00:52:16
Restaurants and buildings, we don't want food trucks to replace those. 00:52:18
Yes. 00:52:25
I'm with you there. 00:52:26
That that's kind of where we're coming from. 00:52:29
So if they're going to be parked there for multiple days, couldn't they just come to you for a special use like 4 day event and 00:52:31
then just for multi day use permits that? 00:52:37
Can be obtained for for special events. 00:52:43
For certain specific circumstances and those are approved at staff level. 00:52:46
Doc's Seafood. 00:52:52
Parks at the Old. 00:52:54
First Savings Bank. 00:52:56
They're there a couple days a week on Thursdays. 00:52:58
Floyd Knobs. 00:53:03
They're in Greenville on Monday, Monday. 00:53:04
So those are on commercial? 00:53:07
Properties, right? 00:53:10
Yeah, I mean, you need some place for people to stop and park and yeah. 00:53:12
That's the idea of having a. 00:53:18
Permanent structure there. That means you're going to have parking you're going to have. 00:53:19
So all I have to do is get a. 00:53:23
Temporary, they wouldn't need anything. They don't need anything meets that criteria. 00:53:25
OK, so this eliminates. 00:53:29
Well then I got. I'm understanding this better. 00:53:31
We don't want to have to do a bunch of permitting, we want people to be able to. 00:53:35
So operate. 00:53:40
You know what they're doing without. 00:53:41
Contact us and get permits all the time so so there's not a permit required to. 00:53:43
If I'm a food truck to do just the health department. 00:53:47
OK, so so. 00:53:50
The whole purpose of this is. 00:53:52
If I had a food truck and I parked it somewhere. 00:53:54
For three days. 00:53:57
But you could come out and say you're in violation. You have to move, right? 00:53:58
If it's that screen. 00:54:03
If if they leave it there overnight. 00:54:04
If they came if the dock. 00:54:06
Comes and goes every day. 00:54:08
To where they want to do business. 00:54:10
No problem. 00:54:12
Right. But if they're there. 00:54:13
I would want to leave it overnight. 00:54:16
Person actually most of these gentlemen. 00:54:18
I don't think they want to leave their stuff unattended. 00:54:23
But they got to go dump their. 00:54:29
They got to dump their wash water somewhere. 00:54:31
That's like one of the Indiana Administrative Code requirements is that they have to go to a commissary nightly. 00:54:35
They can't leave. 00:54:41
Wasted in a restaurant overnight. 00:54:42
That's the whole purpose of having. 00:54:45
Registered vehicle is the one you're done. 00:54:48
Drive it back. 00:54:51
Yeah, get rid of your crap. 00:54:53
So you want the same thing with this? 00:54:56
Yeah, before. 00:54:59
So do we have anything else to add to this? 00:55:01
So. 00:55:04
I contradicts F. 00:55:06
If we're going to say that the food trucks must not block driveways, fire lane sidewalks or accessible parking, but Oh well, it's 00:55:08
a county event, it's fine. 00:55:12
We're contradicting ourselves because we should hold ourselves up to the highest standards and making sure people have. 00:55:16
They're accessible parking and stuff like that. 00:55:22
I'm not following you. I and F contradict each other. Food truck mess. 00:55:25
I mean, I think you can already do some of those things. 00:55:32
Already. 00:55:36
In general, I just think out they. 00:55:38
What I it's not stating you can do it, it's just stating you still have to meet the local. 00:55:40
State no, it says. You're exempt from the above standards and the above standard says. 00:55:46
They oh, they must not, but you still must meet all local state. 00:55:49
Oh, that's only food. Food guidelines. 00:55:53
Yeah, so she's right. 00:55:55
There, Yeah, she is right. 00:55:57
No, it's but still beat local and state food safety guidelines and regulations as well as all applicable Indiana code. 00:56:00
So if the code is stating that you can't block. 00:56:06
So you're saying food? 00:56:09
Safety. 00:56:12
Local state foods. 00:56:13
Safety guidelines and regulations, OK. 00:56:14
As well as all the pills meaning that you don't have to. 00:56:17
Right. No, Sir, but must still. 00:56:20
Me correct. 00:56:22
But it says they're exempt from the above standards and above standard. 00:56:25
Yes, well I can just reword it to state that must still meet the standards outlined in F. 00:56:29
There you go, It's like. 00:56:34
I like that. 00:56:35
As well as. 00:56:38
All local we should be holding ourselves and our events to the highest standards possible. 00:56:39
Because we're the ones setting the examples. 00:56:44
Gotcha. 00:56:46
Good, you just combine them. 00:56:47
Huh. Could you not just combine them? 00:56:50
Both of them, I and the F. 00:56:53
So I actually I agree with you in terms of your. 00:56:55
Understanding of what it's exempting, but I disagree. I think the idea of that. 00:56:58
Item I would be for. 00:57:04
A block party or some sort of? 00:57:07
Official event where we are closing down. 00:57:10
A right away or a sidewalk and we're having. 00:57:13
Food trucks there. Something like Harvest Homecoming would be an exhibit, yes. 00:57:16
I know some fire departments have done fundraisers of that nature. 00:57:24
I think that's what that is. 00:57:29
We need to be a little bit more specific. 00:57:32
Then because I read that and feel like if I'm a lay person that we're contradicting ourselves. 00:57:35
We still have to submit a plan to Homeland Security on any event and that would cover. 00:57:41
All of that. 00:57:47
Ingress Egress. 00:57:50
All of it. 00:57:53
Has to be considered. Before you can hold an event, you have to go. 00:57:54
Come up with your operational plan. 00:57:58
And it has to be submitted to Homeland Security first. 00:58:00
But that would be for the organization and and. 00:58:08
Yeah, if it was the county or if it was. 00:58:10
You know who have to not the owner. 00:58:13
Food. Not the food, no. 00:58:16
It's I'm saying that. 00:58:18
If the county had an event or Georgetown or. 00:58:20
Whoever. 00:58:24
They have to submit a plan to Homeland Security. 00:58:25
And it would cover a lot of. 00:58:29
Those safety issues that she's referring to. 00:58:32
Sidewalks. Probably not one of them, but. 00:58:35
You still gotta have X amount of handicapped spots. 00:58:37
You still have to have. 00:58:40
You know, so many poor cans. 00:58:42
Based on what you. 00:58:45
Thank you. Population is and that type of thing. Yeah. And so again, all the data depends on the like layout. So if you're ever 00:58:46
going to pollinate, right, you see my food trucks are over on our stub. 00:58:51
Fire hydrant still accessible. 00:58:56
It's a wave, right? Parking. Like I put it somewhere. I put my cones up to keep people from driving back there. 00:58:58
But that's me as someone because I'm. 00:59:04
Continuously thinking about everyone's safety whereas someone maybe who's a new organizer. 00:59:06
No, you may not realize that at the time. 00:59:11
Their local fire and police and EMS when they make those decisions. 00:59:15
Hopefully. 00:59:19
Clean that up. 00:59:25
Again, this is at least given a guideline to. 00:59:26
People, the lay people that are owning these trucks. 00:59:30
We got to start somewhere. 00:59:34
Yeah, and I. 00:59:36
I'm familiar with the ones that you've turned down so far, and I think those are the right decisions. 00:59:38
You know, you can't just pull off side the road and. 00:59:45
Start serving fish you know. 00:59:48
Thank you. 00:59:53
Yeah, I like it. So what do we need to? 00:59:54
What's that bird? I like it. So what do we need to do? 00:59:58
Do the same thing we just did. 01:00:01
I think we'll do the same where we're each staff will request a withdrawal is we'll make notes of the suggestions. 01:00:04
We'll have those included. I'll make a motion to withdraw. 01:00:11
2nd please I do have a second on favor. 01:00:15
Aye, good work on the agenda. New business. None correct. 01:00:19
Discussion. 01:00:30
Are we done? 01:00:31
Mr. Nick. Mr. Ray. 01:00:33
I need a motion to adjourn. 01:00:35
I'll make that motion. I need a second. 01:00:36
Second, all in favor signify by thank you guys and girls. 01:00:39
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Documents available for this event
Document Name Document type
Docket FC-07-25-15 - FCZO Amendment 22 General Document
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Transcript

Event transcript
It wasn't even. 00:00:08
OK. 00:00:19
All right, we're going to call the. 00:00:28
We have a meeting of the Floyd County Planning Commission September 8th. 00:00:31
At this time we'd like to and do the police pledge allegiance, please. 00:00:35
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. 00:00:39
And to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God. 00:00:43
Indivisible with liberty and justice for all. 00:00:47
All right. At this time we go for roll call for us please. 00:00:51
Here. 00:00:55
Here. 00:00:57
Here. 00:00:58
Here. 00:01:01
Here. 00:01:05
Here. 00:01:06
Here. 00:01:07
Here. All right, we got enough to have a meeting, so we're good to go. 00:01:09
We don't have any public here, so I guess they. 00:01:12
Really had to make a difference. 00:01:14
OK, this time we need a share by reviewed the minutes from the August 11th meeting. 00:01:16
This time I need a motion to approve those minutes. 00:01:21
I'll make a motion to approve. 00:01:26
The second place I got a. 00:01:28
2nd. 00:01:30
All in favor signify aye. 00:01:31
Aye, those opposed likewise. Thank you. 00:01:34
All right, old business. This is the agenda. 00:01:36
Number one. 00:01:39
FC-07-205-15. 00:01:41
Zoning ordinance amendment at this time, Ray, if you will. 00:01:45
Take it slow for us, please. 00:01:49
All right. Following our last meeting. 00:01:52
Draft today little presentation that just kind of gives an overview of our ordinance as well as the. 00:01:55
Reason we're here at this meeting today to. 00:02:01
Address, you know. 00:02:03
Provisions for. 00:02:05
These two amendments, food trucks and accessory dwelling units. 00:02:06
You all can see it on your screen. 00:02:10
No, I don't have my screen. 00:02:12
We don't have it on these. We got a mountaintop. 00:02:14
I guess you all probably just have to turn around. 00:02:20
OK. 00:02:22
Oh God, I can't turn around, Nicholas. 00:02:25
Whoa. Gonna go be the public. Yeah, I gotta be the public. I cannot. 00:02:28
That I can't do. 00:02:33
No, sorry, I can't see the left side well, we just need to put it in the slideshow view. 00:02:34
Do I really need it one more? 00:02:40
No over to slideshow if the top bar. 00:02:44
That bar, there you go. All right, so this is an overview of our zoning ordinance. 00:02:47
This first slide, so these are the sections of the ordinance. I just kind of summarized them because a lot of them were. 00:02:53
Very detailed and different aspects with. 00:03:00
Specific to what the ordinance they were. 00:03:04
Specifying so Section 1. Our our general provision Section 2. Our definition Section 3. 00:03:09
Non conforming structures, lots and uses. Section 4. Our development standards for zoning districts. Section 5 are general 00:03:15
standards. Section 6 are floodplain regulations. Section 7 are land unit development. 00:03:20
Language and Standards Section 8 or the Overlay Districts Section 9 is the Development review standards. 00:03:27
Section 10 is miscellaneous development standards. Section 11. Drainage and stormwater controls. Section 14. 00:03:33
Sexually oriented business purpose section 15 authority section 16 official zoning map in section 17 is the technical. 00:03:40
Review community and you might be wondering you know some stuff is missing. That's because they've either been. 00:03:49
Repealed or amended. So there are sections that are intentionally missing from there. 00:03:54
Moving on. 00:03:58
So what is the purpose of our zoning ordinance? The purpose of the Floyd County zoning? Zoning. 00:04:00
Sorry, zoning ordinance to regulate land use development. 00:04:04
In a way that promotes public health, safety and general welfare generally, the Orange serves to guide growth and development. 00:04:07
Preserve property values. Facilitate efficient use of amenities, utilities, public infrastructure. 00:04:13
In open space and carry out the goals of the Floyd County Comprehensive Plan and support the long term growth of the county. 00:04:18
What is the purpose of this meeting? 00:04:25
Purpose of this meeting is to discuss these proposed amendments. So why are we doing this? 00:04:27
Well, want to clarify gaps in our current ordinance. There are no Adu or food truck provisions in our ordinance currently. 00:04:32
Two, to add clear standards for food trucks and Adus. 00:04:38
3 to ensure consistency, fairness and enforceability. 00:04:41
Forward to address growing demands amongst many members and stakeholders. 00:04:45
5 to encourage development in Floyd County. 00:04:49
And six, there's a poor small, small, sorry, local small businesses and stimulate economic growth. 00:04:52
In the coming. 00:04:58
Now, this is specific to food trucks for why it is of importance and why we're choosing to. 00:05:01
I had a language for food trucks into our. 00:05:06
A current ordinance or into the. 00:05:09
So we want definitive standards to provide guidance to food truck owners to allow for general oversight and enforceability by our 00:05:11
office. 00:05:14
Standards outline pertain individuals who want to use a lot for permanent use. 00:05:17
Future standards outline primarily defer health and safety requirements to the appropriate governing body. 00:05:21
We don't want to be overly restrictive of food trips, we simply want to be able to have guidelines in place. 00:05:27
Primary reasons to include language in the ordinance Ensure food trucks operate in safe, accessible locations. 00:05:32
Address overnight parking storage to maintain neighborhood character. 00:05:37
Provide clear standards for parking. 00:05:40
Sanitation. 00:05:42
And he's these standards are to be located if you all remember. 00:05:44
Right here, section 10. 00:05:48
Under miscellaneous development standards and food trucks are to be added. 00:05:50
To the land use features. 00:05:54
Accessory dwelling units. So we've seen an increase in inquiries and applications pertaining to accessory dwelling units such as 00:05:58
Courage Homes. We actually just had a. 00:06:01
Item on the agenda. 00:06:05
Not too long, about an hour ago. 00:06:06
For carriage home. 00:06:08
Human occupancy is prohibited by the Floyd County zoning ordinance, so. 00:06:10
Homeowners want to incorporate ad use on a property have had to submit development standards Variance application. 00:06:14
Where the Board of Zoning Appeals stipulated the conditions. 00:06:18
We want to streamline this process by including provisions for Adus in the ordinance so that. 00:06:22
Development standard variants are only necessary if the applicant can't meet all. 00:06:26
Standards. 00:06:30
Primary reasons to include language in the floor county zoning ordinance are to provide standards and guidelines for community 00:06:31
members. 00:06:33
Provide affordable and flexible housing options for community members. 00:06:36
Direct development toward existing communities and provide and promote the efficient use of existing lots and infrastructures. 00:06:40
Or infrastructure. 00:06:46
These standards are to be included in. 00:06:47
Right there, Section 5 under general standards. 00:06:50
Under a subsection for Accessory uses structures. 00:06:54
So what are the next steps? 00:06:58
Review and discuss Adu and food truck standards provided by staff and make recommendations. Slash revisions to standards to 00:07:01
advance proposed amendments to county commissioners. 00:07:05
And include provisions neither the current. 00:07:09
Floyd County Zone Horns or the UDO to be released late this year, early next year. 00:07:11
So that's just kind of my quick little. 00:07:16
I say to you, tell me. 00:07:19
An ad use. Yeah, that's that's actually what I was going to go through. 00:07:23
Next. 00:07:26
OK, solidly. 00:07:39
Chris, take a seat. 00:07:41
So the way I kind of want to go through this is I want to go. 00:07:43
First over the definitions and go down each line item. 00:07:46
If anyone has any feedback, we'll just kind of discuss it. 00:07:52
Right then and there, so that way we're not just jumping all over. 00:07:55
Actually, Ray, why don't you go through? 00:08:01
The entire Adu. 00:08:03
Standards that were. 00:08:05
Suggesting. 00:08:07
Then we'll talk about those and then we'll move on. 00:08:08
Alright, so we'll start off with the definition. 00:08:13
Support Accessory Dwelling is a subordinate residential dwelling unit located on the same line as the principal single family 00:08:16
dwelling. 00:08:19
Adu provides complete independent living facilities for one or more persons and includes. 00:08:22
Permanent provisions for living, sleeping, eating, cooking and sanitation. 00:08:27
Maybe you must be detached from the principal dwelling. It must be clearly subordinate in size, location and function. 00:08:31
So going down. 00:08:36
The Accessory Dwelling Unit Standards section applies to the following districts. ARRSU&R, SO. 00:08:38
Item A and especially dwelling unit is considered an accessory structure slash. Use and should. 00:08:44
Sorry and shall comply with all development standards for subject zoning district. 00:08:49
Necessary dwelling shall meet the accessory. 00:08:53
Structured slash use standards for its applicable zoning district. 00:08:56
Item C An accessory building unit shall be permitted only in association with and on the same lot as the primary structure. 00:09:00
And must be consistent with the character. 00:09:06
Anesthetic of the primary structure. 00:09:08
Item D, an accessory dwelling unit, is not allowed on a lot prior to a primary structure being constructed. 00:09:10
Out of me, an accessory dwelling unit shall be secondary to the primary structure and height and square footage. 00:09:16
Item F No mobile home or manufacturing home may be using his accessory. 00:09:21
Item G uh. 00:09:25
Only one assessed renegade is permitted per parcel. 00:09:26
Item H. 00:09:29
Primary structure and accessory dwelling unit is located on. Must be owner occupied by. 00:09:31
Item I and accessory dueling unit must be connected to public water. 00:09:35
And sewer or September? 00:09:39
Jay has accessory dwelling. Any must include a separate entrance, sleeping area, dining area and bathroom facility as the primary 00:09:41
structure. 00:09:44
OK, home occupations are not permitted in an accessory. 00:09:48
Dwelling Unit. 00:09:51
In item L, an accessory dwelling unit intended to be used as a short term rental shall receive. 00:09:52
Approval as a conditional use. 00:09:57
So that those are the standards that we kind of looked through and thought would be appropriate for an accessory dwelling unit. 00:10:08
As as Ray was saying. 00:10:15
We do have these come up. 00:10:17
Somewhat frequently we get them asked about. 00:10:19
Pretty frequently. 00:10:22
At when they come to the BZA, we. 00:10:23
Often are approving them with conditions. 00:10:26
And so we were trying to. 00:10:29
Developed some standards. 00:10:30
To apply so that people that want to do have these ad use would not be required to come in and get special approvals. 00:10:32
If we're going to be approving them. 00:10:40
Consistently with certain conditions anyway. 00:10:42
So this is what we kind of had. 00:10:45
Developed. 00:10:47
And we wanted. 00:10:48
Feedback. What? What? You're all spot on. 00:10:50
Do we want to have these standards at all? 00:10:53
Do we want to just continue having them come through a special exceptions? 00:10:56
If not, which of these standards are appropriate? Do we want more? Do we want? 00:11:02
Something that we're not. 00:11:06
Saying you know 1. 00:11:08
That I look at here is we have it. So this would be an all residential districts. 00:11:11
I might consider, you know, only an AR and R districts where the property sizes are larger. 00:11:17
Might be a reasonable restriction, and then if if they wanted to do something in an Rs or an R, you'd still come in. 00:11:25
To kind of get approval so that we're not. 00:11:32
Crowding people. 00:11:35
More than we would. 00:11:36
Like. 00:11:40
I guess that's what we're we're looking for feedback here. I think ultimately what we're. 00:11:41
Probably going to do is. 00:11:46
As staff request to withdraw this recommendation and then just. 00:11:49
Pocketed for the Unified Development Code, but we want. 00:11:53
The plan Commission input on what that should ultimately be. I have a question for you. 00:11:59
On K home Occupy. 00:12:03
Occupations. 00:12:05
Are not so permitted in the dwelling so. 00:12:07
No occupation of business can be ran out of that dwell. 00:12:10
Correct. So currently they can. Now they're the personal home, yeah. 00:12:13
Currently, we have we allow home occupations so long as they meet certain standards to find in our ordinance. 00:12:17
And so this is just limiting it so that you. 00:12:25
Can't you know that's a little more intensive of abuse than what we were? 00:12:27
OK. So just to, I mean Larry and I both are on the BCA. We just had one of these come through. 00:12:32
In the meeting prior to this. 00:12:37
All of them that I've been involved for the past 10 years. 00:12:40
Probably been a half a dozen more. We've approved them all. 00:12:43
And I think they as the staff, they identified the things that we kind of. 00:12:46
Add to the the stipulation. So they've kind of caught that. 00:12:52
And over the years, that's that's what we see that the conditions we used to have make sure we. 00:12:56
We applied to or we applied to them. 00:13:02
So if that helps you as far as just to kind of look at it, I mean, I think it's nothing about. 00:13:04
I think y'all done a great job identifying what? 00:13:09
What the main issues are. So I think that's what he's wanting to just some. 00:13:12
Feedback on. 00:13:16
If you think this is enough for it's too much or whatever and do you agree with staff being able just to approve these so? 00:13:17
That's that's say that correctly. 00:13:23
Well, you're right. 00:13:27
We would not even need to. They would be by. 00:13:29
If so, meet these standards. 00:13:32
I know I did review the video in the minutes from last. I know there were some questions I. 00:13:35
I don't know that we answered all of them, so if those are still. 00:13:41
Lingering questions. 00:13:44
You know, please pose them again and I'll try to answer them. 00:13:46
I could. 00:13:50
Basically like Victor said, based on. 00:13:51
What we've done in the past. 00:13:54
In the in the very first part of it, it says one or more persons. Everything we've done to date is always seems to have been. 00:13:55
For our mother-in-law or father-in-law or somebody like that. 00:14:03
So. And I don't think you want to. 00:14:07
A family of 6 living in an Adu. So I'm thinking it ought to save one or two persons, not be. 00:14:09
One or more persons, I think they're. 00:14:16
And just to thought, my thought that went through my head. 00:14:18
Yeah, I think it becomes difficult to. 00:14:21
What about a mother and a baby? 00:14:25
You know what? You know, it gets difficult. I think that's where you where. 00:14:27
The idea is to. 00:14:31
Limit this. 00:14:33
The space and what? How much space they can have? What is required in it? 00:14:34
Well, we don't see anything about square footage here. 00:14:40
It's got to be smaller than the primary well, and that's where I have a couple of the Bourbon views, two different verbages from 00:14:43
the same thing and I think we need to use the same verbiage. So in the definition, use subordinate in size and location and 00:14:47
function. 00:14:51
But on E you say it shall be secondary to the primary, so I think you're both trying to say it so. 00:14:55
You're trying to say the same thing twice, and you need to use the same verbiage. 00:15:00
Yeah, consistent. 00:15:03
Yeah. 00:15:05
Yeah, we we can make that. 00:15:09
Distinction. 00:15:11
Yeah, it makes sense because because the standard helps. 00:15:15
Dictate that it is smaller because otherwise I say you need to use the word smaller because not everyone's got a Rick Fox sitting 00:15:18
right next to them when they're coming to you. 00:15:21
Well, and then if you're using two different words, the court's going to look at that and say, well, why did they do that? What 00:15:26
was their intent? 00:15:29
Right. Umm. 00:15:32
Yes, I got the approved lawyer that I was right when I looked at that. Yes, yes. 00:15:33
So I've got a question for those. You've been sitting here for a while and you said you've approved. 00:15:39
Half a dozen or a dozen of them. 00:15:44
So I have great concern about. 00:15:48
You know what happens later on down the road. 00:15:53
So I build a. 00:15:56
Smaller place. 00:15:58
Why don't my neighbors? 00:16:00
That have property. Why don't they complain and say well why didn't they subdivide that property? 00:16:02
And what happens with? 00:16:08
Moms passed away. 00:16:12
And we want to sell that. 00:16:14
Is there? 00:16:16
One driveway is there, two driveways is there. On the one we did, the one we approved tonight, we sent them. They couldn't have 00:16:17
subdivided off. 00:16:21
We totally couldn't do that. 00:16:25
Some we told them they couldn't rent it out either. 00:16:28
What do they do with it? 00:16:32
I mean. 00:16:34
Times gonna. 00:16:35
Time is my big question. I think I, I think you actually are hitting on one of the issues that we identify as that. 00:16:36
When we have been approving these for specific individual. 00:16:43
Well, that individual goes and then. 00:16:47
The structure is still there. 00:16:49
How are they going to reasonably use it? Someone else is going to, Yeah, I mean, that's my. And then it becomes a difficulty to. 00:16:54
To regulate that, to police that and someone did complain. 00:17:00
You know, how do we handle that? 00:17:04
So yes, that that's one of the reasons why we wanted to kind of. 00:17:06
That's one of my concerns is what happens down the road. My other concern that. 00:17:10
I've checked with the health department and said wait a minute, what about septic? 00:17:16
Because. 00:17:20
You know you're tapping into. Well, Monday night we told them they had to get. 00:17:21
They had to get approval from the health department to be able to add the bathroom and stuff. 00:17:25
So when you go build the place, they say how many bathrooms you gonna have and how many people have lived there, and then they 00:17:29
tell you what kind of septic you're gonna have. 00:17:34
Well, now five years goes by or 10 years goes by. 00:17:38
We don't even know what the septic looks like. 00:17:42
But uh. 00:17:45
Now we're saying, yeah, go ahead and tap into that. That kind of counterproductive, The health department would still have to 00:17:45
approve. 00:17:49
That additional dwelling unit, this additional accessory structure we actually have that it must connect to sewer septic and in 00:17:53
the health department. You're right when they. 00:17:58
Make their initial approval. It's based on how many bedrooms you have in there. 00:18:03
But they they can go out and. 00:18:09
Add additional a lot of Sept. 00:18:11
Have more capacity than what they are initially. 00:18:13
Dealt with, but that would be a requirement that they are on an adequate septic system. 00:18:17
You're open up. I mean to your point, we and everyone that we approved. 00:18:23
Everyone of them when they come up in front of us. 00:18:27
The guy this tonight said, you know, I, you know, I can't think about, even think about putting my mother-in-law in a nursing 00:18:30
home. 00:18:33
You know they give us the. 00:18:37
The story OK, which is. 00:18:38
True. OK. 00:18:40
And then? 00:18:42
Everyone. I'm had that. That's the same story you have. 00:18:42
Everyone of them, it's either for a mother-in-law or an elderly person or something of that nature, and every time we've approved 00:18:45
it. 00:18:49
We sit and talk about the same thing. 00:18:53
What's going to happen when that? 00:18:55
Person dies. 00:18:56
And that becomes empty. 00:18:58
Well, more likely without us knowing. 00:19:01
They're probably going to rent it. 00:19:04
I mean, you know. 00:19:06
So they're probably gonna find some iron tape. 00:19:07
It hopefully it's a relative but. 00:19:10
There's no guarantee it is, but. 00:19:12
I don't know how you police it so. 00:19:14
You'd either have to say. 00:19:16
Were never proven 1. 00:19:17
And that's the only way you can control it. 00:19:20
I don't know either way you could. 00:19:23
Because if you stipulate that if that person leaves. 00:19:24
And if anybody else other than the original intended person. 00:19:28
Is no longer occupying that structure. 00:19:32
We shall be notified. 00:19:35
Whoo, I don't know that's. 00:19:37
It's a thought, right? 00:19:38
No, I'm, I'm at the point where you said you've approved 10 or 12. I want to go by the addresses and see what's going on. 00:19:41
1/2 a dozen. Stop stretching, Frank. 00:19:47
So I mean, that's kind of where I'm at is I want, I'd like to see what's going on. I'd like to see the structure that they put up. 00:19:49
And you don't have to go very far from here and there's a bunch of mini ohms. 00:19:57
Sitting in backyards and what I remember, a little bit bigger than a Playhouse, you know? 00:20:01
We put one out on Corn Ridge Rd. I remember that. You remember that one that was in the back. 00:20:07
The one tonight you approved. 00:20:12
Is on. 00:20:13
Office, Scottsville Rd. Run. 00:20:15
So anyway, to your point, I don't know how you police it. 00:20:18
And I don't know what you do unless you put a condition. 00:20:21
As I said. 00:20:24
If that is no longer occupied by the original intended person. 00:20:25
Then you need to get additional approval. 00:20:30
Well then. 00:20:32
Are we opening ourselves up for? 00:20:36
A issue down the road? 00:20:39
You. That would be something either way. 00:20:41
That would. 00:20:44
Yeah, that would not be something that the county wants to get involved. 00:20:44
Policing. No, no, I'm talking about. 00:20:49
If they if the stipulations were put on there and then those people. 00:20:52
Don't abide by the stipulations. 00:20:57
I mean, I don't know what happens. 00:21:00
Well, the only thing is, if someone complained, we would investigate it and we would determine if it's. 00:21:02
That individual that's supposed to be there and that we would write them a note of violation if it wasn't. So yes, we would get 00:21:08
involved in policing that situation. And if we don't want to, the only other way you could do that is if you say every year they 00:21:12
have to, they have to. 00:21:17
So they have to sign in. 00:21:22
Or they have to send to the county. 00:21:24
That the. 00:21:26
The the. 00:21:27
Structures being occupied for 10 games every year. They gotta send that in. 00:21:29
Well then at some point. 00:21:33
They're either. They're either Lion. 00:21:35
Or if they didn't send it in, then at that point we could have a checklist that we call them up and say why didn't you send it 00:21:38
this? 00:21:41
So then the other. 00:21:44
The real estate question is. 00:21:45
Is that? 00:21:48
Well, I guess there's more than that because. 00:21:49
How are we taxing that? 00:21:52
The assessor's goods out there and is it 2 houses or one? 00:21:54
I I don't know how the assessors would look at that. It's, it's a secondary structure. It's kind of like a, a garage or. 00:21:58
Something of that nature I think they would do, except for a lot more. 00:22:05
Huh. Except for a lot. Well, yeah, but. 00:22:09
This was but once again. 00:22:11
Every time we've approved one, it's always been a hardship. 00:22:14
Situation. So I mean it's. 00:22:17
You know, you're sitting here in front of the board, in public, in the whole 9 yards, this guy saying, you know, my 00:22:19
mother-in-law's meant to go in a nursing home. 00:22:22
We don't have room in the house. 00:22:26
You know I asked the question tonight. 00:22:28
That the the bedroom is going to be on 2nd floor and I said. 00:22:30
If you put an elevator. 00:22:33
He said no, but we're putting a lift in. OK, Well, he. 00:22:35
A chair, stairway, lift or something like that. But at least he had a right answer. 00:22:37
He didn't say. 00:22:41
We're not putting anything in them. They're not have to question. 00:22:42
The intent, you know what I'm saying? You're putting your mile on the 2nd floor and you're worried about her. 00:22:45
Nursing home. 00:22:49
So, you know, so so those ones that. 00:22:50
That you guys have approved so far, What kind of acreage? 00:22:52
Have you been, I mean, what size lots are these things going on now? 00:22:56
That one actually was. 00:22:59
What was it for? 00:23:00
War acre lot. 00:23:02
So about two acre lot on that which is about our AR. 00:23:05
Our largest lot standard. 00:23:09
Typically they are in rural residential AR districts, so typically our larger lots typically. 00:23:11
Kind of out. 00:23:17
Play. So would you not? I mean, you mentioned looking at. 00:23:19
Anchorage, I guess, or size of the lot. 00:23:24
Versus the size of the building, would you do a percentage of? 00:23:27
The main structure to the secondary structure would that's. 00:23:30
You know, would that simplify it more? 00:23:34
I think if you want, if you were concerned, you could do a minimum square footage. We have minimum square footage for primary 00:23:37
structures. 00:23:40
Yeah, but well, more of a maximum. 50 is our minimum. 00:23:44
And uh. 00:23:49
But you still want it. You do. You definitely would want it to be subordinate to the. 00:23:50
Primary structure. 00:23:54
Because then you're then you're in the multifamily. You're basically going to be multifamily if they wrote. 00:23:57
The one, the one tonight was 3/4 of an acre, Yeah. 00:24:02
Is what it was in Fox Hill states. 00:24:05
And real nice house on the right and the structure he's going to build. 00:24:07
It's going to be. 00:24:11
Behind the original. 00:24:12
Front building line of the house that's already there. 00:24:14
Then he's what he's doing is going to be. 00:24:17
It's going to be an attractability. It's a garage on the lower level. 00:24:19
So he is thinking ahead somewhat there, you know, in other words. 00:24:22
Whatever, the upstairs is not going to be needed. 00:24:26
He's got a garage. He's. 00:24:29
There's a purpose for it. No, I get it. Other than that, you understand what I'm saying. So. 00:24:31
I mean, I think. 00:24:35
Once again sitting in my seat. 00:24:36
You think I take a ******** saying we're not going to ever approve one? 00:24:38
Which? 00:24:42
I don't know if anybody agrees with that then if you do approve it then. 00:24:43
They've come up with the guidelines we've obviously. 00:24:46
Or being asked to add to it. 00:24:49
And so that's, yeah, whatever. At least you get a start. 00:24:51
Yeah, that's what we're saying. 00:24:56
Definitely. 00:24:58
In BZA, the Planning Commission is still going to. 00:25:00
Be looking. 00:25:03
Blanketed well, one of the key things I think is the use of the property is not substantially different by adding an accessory 00:25:05
dwelling unit. 00:25:09
Still still a residential. 00:25:15
Residential essentially a single. 00:25:18
You could have a secondary, but it would be subordinate, so it would be, you know, one or two other people living in. 00:25:21
You could have the same problem of. 00:25:27
You know we have. 00:25:29
Five people live in in one room in a single family house. 00:25:31
And people coming in and going like that, same issue. 00:25:36
I know where those addresses are. 00:25:39
But that same issue would be. 00:25:43
That is a concern with Adus is this. 00:25:45
Concern with single family houses it's not. 00:25:48
So I quit, I questioned. And Rick this question for you. 00:25:50
Is that? 00:25:53
You know some people. 00:25:54
If they had to sign some type of affidavit that says. 00:25:56
I hereby. 00:25:59
Verify that under. 00:26:01
Whatever oath or whatever that I will not. 00:26:02
Use this dwelling other than what the intent I've been I'll get approved for. 00:26:05
And you know, they sign it. I mean, some people, just the fact that they sign. 00:26:11
Some saying they will not do it. 00:26:15
There's, you know, the majority of people are honest. 00:26:17
OK, so I mean there are some that aren't, but at least. 00:26:20
In their mind, they've signed something that said. 00:26:23
I will not use it for anything of the intent. 00:26:26
But what do you do with that affidavit when the property owner? 00:26:28
Vacates. 00:26:31
Sells it. 00:26:32
That he has to answer whether it goes with the deed. 00:26:34
Whether it's part of the deed, can they subdivide it at that point? 00:26:36
You would only be able to subdivide it if. 00:26:40
It met. 00:26:43
The standards. 00:26:44
Of a normal. 00:26:46
It would still need to meet all the other standards. If they're kind into the septic system, then they got a problem. 00:26:48
Right. You gotta have separate that's why they would have to buy. So they would probably they they could try, yeah. 00:26:55
So I guess that would be illegal non conforming. 00:27:02
I guess my big question is. 00:27:05
Are we considering this to make it easier for? 00:27:07
Or are we considering this because? 00:27:12
The BCA doesn't want to make the decision or why don't we just keep it the way it is, which is a total it's a possibility. We 00:27:16
absolutely can. I'm not against it was if we're approving these. 00:27:22
Repeatedly. 00:27:29
With basically the same standards. 00:27:30
Why are we asking people? 00:27:32
To pay $300, have a public hearing, do the whole thing. 00:27:34
If if it's basically. 00:27:39
Well, he said, he's only listened to six of them. 00:27:43
Right. I get that right. 6-6 of them in 10 years. So I don't know that it's worth. 00:27:46
But I mean, I don't think it's an over. It's not overly burdened staff to do this. 00:27:55
The thought was we're always having to say it's, it's, it's, it's kind of a rubber stamp when you come through where. 00:28:00
If it's for this, this and this. 00:28:08
These are the conditions it gets approved. 00:28:10
Why are we asking property owners? 00:28:12
To pay all this extra to go through this process. 00:28:14
If it's. 00:28:18
Going to be approved anyway. 00:28:20
See, I feel better. 00:28:22
Not coming from the BCA. 00:28:23
If they had to sign after. 00:28:25
That I mean to me I just. 00:28:27
You know. 00:28:29
To me, I'd feel more comfortable with that than what we're going through, I think. 00:28:30
And Mr. Luke? 00:28:33
This would only. 00:28:36
When it the time comes, whatever provisions we put in here will come to the commissioners for their decision on it as well. It's 00:28:38
just recommendation. Is it? 00:28:42
But at least gives guidelines. 00:28:47
Yeah, in, in. 00:28:49
Reference to an index. 00:28:50
To go compared to what? 00:28:53
You know, I don't want to give the impression that. 00:28:55
Staff is neither for or against this. This is what we are. You know, this comes up. We're just. 00:29:00
You know, this is for you all to decide whether you want to. I think it's needed. 00:29:06
I like it. One other thing that kind of addresses like, OK, we've got a shared driveway, whatever. How are we, how are emergency 00:29:10
personnel distinguishing if? 00:29:14
Going to. 00:29:18
100 Scottsville Rd. 00:29:20
House A or House B in an emergency situation. 00:29:21
How are we distinguishing that? 00:29:25
How would that be? Well, the post office has to give an address if. 00:29:29
That had their own address, OK. 00:29:35
Again, so it could be like the A or B, it's going to be an address, it's going to be 7 address. Could it be like 3806 A and? 00:29:38
They're separate. I don't know about. 00:29:50
All that well and address this company, give us a separate address. 00:29:54
I think that would you guys see? 00:29:58
I tell the post office, well it's not a problem with 911 as long as they have an address. But if that's supposed to be a relative. 00:30:04
Hopefully they're. 00:30:11
They're the ones that are opening the door for us. Well, I was thinking of OK if. 00:30:12
Primary residence people are home. 00:30:16
Mother-in-law's home has a heart attack or whatever and is calling and no one else is. 00:30:18
Well, they check all the. 00:30:22
Structures again, yeah. 00:30:24
Just fire EMS, please check all the structures. 00:30:25
I don't. 00:30:29
Somebody called from there. 00:30:30
Maybe. 00:30:32
OK, so. 00:30:38
Just to kind of almost play devil's advocate. 00:30:39
You know, umm. 00:30:42
On the four side of ad use, I see more AD use going on in like the city on smaller lots. 00:30:43
With people trying to offset, you know, with rentals. 00:30:48
And I think that's great. You know, the housing. 00:30:52
You know, affordable housing. 00:30:54
You can do this. 00:30:55
You know, out in the county. 00:30:56
I see where it may not be looked at that way, where you're doing it actually for your for your in laws. 00:30:58
You know, and I don't know if it's necessarily to create a rental situation. I think there's a good safeguard in there. Letter H, 00:31:03
you know, it has to be owner occupied. 00:31:07
You know, most, most real estate investors who are just buying the property gonna slap an Adu. They can't do it. They just won't 00:31:11
do it because they don't live there. 00:31:15
So I think that's a good safeguard. 00:31:18
You know, I appreciate that, yeah. 00:31:20
So I think H is good if we, you know, if we want to go that route. 00:31:23
But I think that that's a good protection. 00:31:26
On just creating a bunch of multifamily. 00:31:29
On on lots and really when you get down the road. 00:31:31
It seems like just letting the cards fall as it may in terms of. 00:31:36
Not having the police, all of that of. 00:31:40
I mean, it puts a strain on government. 00:31:43
In terms of having the police. 00:31:45
You know, typically if you're going to go to court, then you have. 00:31:51
Pork cost and all that stuff associated with it and it's. 00:31:55
It's it's just a drain on local government. I see that and every time we pass something. 00:31:59
And you got to police it. 00:32:04
Yep. 00:32:05
OK then. 00:32:09
So. 00:32:10
Rick, what are you saying then don't don't have guidelines? No, no. 00:32:11
This is perfectly fine. 00:32:15
The affidavit part, yeah. 00:32:17
Don't do that just. 00:32:19
You know, it was, it was a great purpose when it was done. 00:32:21
And then let the new owners take care of it. 00:32:24
The way they're going to take. 00:32:27
And so, you know, I think there's there's a market out there far. 00:32:29
You know, families that do have, you know, they may be looking specifically for that type thing. 00:32:35
Mother-in-law or father-in-law, little house. And so that's detached. Yeah. And you're gonna get some of that anyway if you get 00:32:40
somebody that rents it. 00:32:44
Let him do it. 00:32:48
It's just it's difficult to police and. 00:32:50
It to me it's a waste of money for government. 00:32:55
To police. 00:32:57
And just as property owners. 00:32:59
You know, like I said, what? 00:33:04
Let the property owners make. 00:33:06
Make those decisions? Well, it's their property. Tell them what they can and can't do. 00:33:08
Is somewhat fine, so expand expand a little bit on that as far as. 00:33:13
Do you think this should be put? 00:33:19
Into I do staff. 00:33:21
I do, I think because it gives it. 00:33:24
I you know if I was. 00:33:26
Republican, you know, I have land if I wanted to do something like this. 00:33:29
At least I have some guidelines. 00:33:32
Instead of being. 00:33:35
Wide open. 00:33:36
And it does restrict, I mean when it goes to. 00:33:38
BZA, there's other members there. 00:33:42
You know they switch. 00:33:46
Every other year? What? Whatever. 00:33:47
Other part. 00:33:50
At least you get a guideline of what what's there. 00:33:50
And you go from there. I, I know I would like, like to have a guideline. 00:33:53
Of some time. 00:33:59
In the way you've got it indexed too. 00:34:01
Compared to what? 00:34:03
Been working on for a couple years on the. 00:34:05
The master plan. 00:34:07
You know, it makes it a lot easier in it. 00:34:09
Floyd County's already. 00:34:13
Tough enough. 00:34:14
To get stuff approved. 00:34:15
This at least. 00:34:18
Having guidelines makes it a little bit more user friendly. 00:34:20
At least half and. 00:34:23
Right, so we got guidelines. 00:34:24
So back to the I mean, we can't, I mean, we've got enough people here have a straw ball. It doesn't mean anything. 00:34:26
How many people thinks it needs to stay? 00:34:33
At the BZA level. 00:34:35
I would personally. 00:34:38
Think thinking with two hats here 1 is a. 00:34:39
Say the consumer owner of the property. 00:34:44
I wouldn't want to go in front of the BZL all the time. 00:34:47
So show, show. I mean, it's not a vote, but show. 00:34:49
Who thinks it should stay in the BCA versus it should? 00:34:53
The guidelines should be passed on. 00:34:56
I think the guidelines should be passed on personally. 00:34:58
I like the guidelines, but I think Frank brings up some good points about the septics and you know, I think though, that kind of 00:35:01
needs to be ironed out more. 00:35:04
That's taken care of it. That's that. That is well, you got to get approval. 00:35:07
One thing I guess either I wasn't clear, didn't get asked. 00:35:13
Let's say I've got 5 acres. 00:35:20
And I want to put 2 Adus. 00:35:22
Yeah, you you can't do too. 00:35:25
Why not? Because, uh. 00:35:27
It says no. And here it does say that there's only one. It says that there's only one. 00:35:29
Under item. 00:35:35
It's only one. 00:35:37
100 foot Rd. frontage if it had the square footage. 00:35:40
For a lot. Am I saying that correct? 00:35:44
Well, that's just going to be another house if you're going to divide it off. Yeah, be just building. That's that's the way they 00:35:47
could do. 00:35:50
But it have to be done or it has to be done or 50 square feet. 00:35:54
Correct. Yeah, yeah. 00:35:58
To be able to. 00:35:59
You all remember anything else? 00:36:02
Of Buff Creek Rd. Plague. 00:36:04
Didn't they build 1? 00:36:07
Carry large carriage house. 00:36:08
Doubt no. Do you remember anything Victor played Buck Creek Rd. There was one that he built a barn. 00:36:12
Out front. 00:36:18
The only thing I remember, yeah, that's why he built a barn out front of his house. 00:36:20
We allowed that, you know. 00:36:23
Hey, that's not bad for an old guy. 00:36:26
Ray, I guess. 00:36:28
From what I just got a couple of comments, I'm not sure what we're singing, we're singing. 00:36:32
There's nothing in here right now that says it has to be a relative. 00:36:38
And I don't know if that's what we're wanting. 00:36:41
Should it say that the person has to be a relative of the? 00:36:43
Of the property. Well, if we're not gonna have an affidavit, then it's kind of hard. We won't do it after. Yeah, it's gonna be 00:36:46
hard to kind of police. 00:36:50
Are, you know, how are we going to be able to enforce that their relatives were not at that point, it's like, well, take, take it 00:36:54
a step further, maybe not an affidavit. 00:36:57
But when they come in for the. 00:37:01
Permit just have it on the permit where they say I hereby certify. 00:37:03
I hereby state that. 00:37:09
This is being used and whatever you want to put. 00:37:10
At least they sign it. OK, Not an affidavit, just. 00:37:13
At least the person knows. 00:37:16
You know, can't say, well, I didn't understand. I couldn't do that. 00:37:18
Well, you signed that. You said you could do it. 00:37:21
You know when somebody said, I think that's one of the issues we have. 00:37:23
I have at least is. 00:37:26
Is restricting these to to relatives. 00:37:28
Is is a short term? 00:37:31
2 needs down the line, but that building is going to be there. 00:37:36
For, that's what I use. For I don't. I don't know how you do. 00:37:41
That was a question. I wasn't making a. 00:37:45
That's why we've never I can see. 00:37:47
I mean it is. It is called an accessory dwelling unit. 00:37:50
And you have a guest, so I want to be your son. 00:37:53
I want to build it. 00:37:55
I've known people, they've called and said, hey, I, you know, I wanna. 00:37:56
My son's coming back from. 00:38:00
University and. 00:38:02
He doesn't want to live in the house, he wants his own living quarters, so for saying. 00:38:03
You know the mother-in-law or widowed, you know. 00:38:07
Whatever, uh. 00:38:10
It's going to be hard to kind of be able to, you know? 00:38:11
Police that if we're just saying, oh, it has to be just this kind of family member as opposed, OK, somebody calls you and they 00:38:14
said their kids coming back from college and they don't want to live at home. They need to get their own place and a job. 00:38:19
I mean it's. 00:38:27
OK. 00:38:30
On age. 00:38:34
I understand it's supposed to be. 00:38:35
Primary structure. 00:38:37
Owner occupied. I think it needs. 00:38:39
I don't think it's very clear the way it's currently written. 00:38:42
I would rewrite that a little bit. 00:38:45
The primary structure where the accessory journal. 00:38:47
Unit is located, must be owner occupied. I'd reward that so. 00:38:50
A little more clear. 00:38:55
OK. And then on item? 00:38:57
I think I would add. 00:39:00
Where I got sewer and septic tank that that requires Ford County Health Department approval. I would add that. 00:39:01
In item J since it's a separate structure. 00:39:08
I don't think you need to. I think it's redundant to say. 00:39:11
Separate entrance. 00:39:14
It won't have we had it, you said. 00:39:16
Could be attached. Yeah, that's where I removed that language. You probably need to remove the word entrance off of J. 00:39:18
And I'll shut up. 00:39:24
Well, if it's it. 00:39:26
If it's attached, it's not a separate. It's it's not, it's not just a renovation, yes. 00:39:27
Yeah, that's what we clarified, yes. 00:39:34
I do think that brings up and it was mentioned a couple times. 00:39:42
I think we probably do want to add some language. 00:39:46
Regarding that. 00:39:50
The driveway, I think we want a single driveway. We don't. 00:39:51
1 addition is being. 00:39:55
Added for these. 00:39:59
That's good. Good catch. 00:40:01
And we decided to. 00:40:03
That the primary residence had to be owner occupied. 00:40:04
So we didn't have a bunch of people coming in just buy a house and build another one. 00:40:08
Next to it. 00:40:12
OK. 00:40:14
I'm a little bit. 00:40:18
More comfortable than the last time we met. 00:40:19
Well, well, you've got. 00:40:25
More exposure to. 00:40:26
The the lower ask yourself. 00:40:31
Watch yourself of those that don't follow the rules. 00:40:34
Thank you. 00:40:44
So we have a couple edits to make here. 00:40:49
Do we want to? 00:40:56
Table is for. 00:40:59
With revision. 00:41:00
And bring it back for recommendation. 00:41:02
Or would you all prefer we just? 00:41:05
Fall back and update it with the the UDL update. 00:41:07
I don't have the Unified Development ordinance. 00:41:13
Putting the subdivision control ordinance. 00:41:16
And the zoning ordinance together. 00:41:19
With Ray here, we've actually been able to progress that again. So we hope we. 00:41:22
He had a timeline. 00:41:27
With this view, with this few of these as we have, I would just say put it in with the big change, yeah. 00:41:28
Not make it a separate thing. 00:41:34
So. 00:41:36
And that comes for the commissioners anyhow, Yeah. 00:41:37
Yeah, I just do that too. So with that, staff's going to request that we withdraw that. 00:41:40
OK, so do we need a motion for that? I make a motion to withdraw accessory dwelling unit. 00:41:46
Standards from. 00:41:51
All right, so I got a second. All in favor say aye. 00:41:55
Those opposed likewise. 00:42:01
There you go. So let it be put in with you. Need something filled out? We're still going to do food truck, right? Yeah, we're 00:42:03
still going to do food truck. But do you need anything side to fill out? 00:42:07
No, OK. 00:42:12
Gotcha. The record sufficient, but we got new food trucks. You're making me hungry. Stop talking about. 00:42:14
At the last meeting I brought up the amendments. You wanted to add a. 00:42:22
To the ordinance pertaining to provisions for food trucks similar to the. 00:42:26
Since we're dueling units, I'm going to just go over the definition and then. 00:42:32
Go down the items and then. 00:42:35
We'll discuss after work. So food trucks are self-propelled, fully licensed motor vehicle and movable trailer design and equip to 00:42:36
prepare, cook. 00:42:40
Served for Sofia and or beverages. 00:42:44
To the public. 00:42:47
Food truck may not be permanently fixed any location or connected to permanent water. 00:42:48
Sewer or electrical systems. 00:42:53
The Future Standards sections apply to the following districts. 00:42:56
And CGCHS OB. 00:42:59
And GI item a food trucks must apply with. 00:43:01
Applicable state and local food safety guidelines regulations, as well as applicable Indiana State codes. 00:43:05
Regulating mobile food establishments. 00:43:10
Item B Food trucks. 00:43:13
Must be located on a lot with an established structure. Use. 00:43:15
Item C Food trucks shall not be parked overnight at the site or location from which they operate. 00:43:18
Unless fully screened from the view of the right of way. 00:43:23
In a or in a completely closed building. 00:43:25
Item D Food trucks must have access to and from the. 00:43:28
Which they will be located via a driveway which must be paved. 00:43:31
Item E Food trucks must remain operable and mobile at all times and not they shall not be permanently connected to utilities, 00:43:35
foundations, or other structures. 00:43:39
Item F Food trucks must not block driveways, fire lanes, sidewalks or accessible parking. 00:43:44
Spaces Item G Food truck lighting must be shielded and fixed downward. Item H Food trucks shall not operate in any right of way. 00:43:49
Item I Food trucks operating as part of a county permitted event. 00:43:57
Are exempt from the above. Stamina's must, must. I'm sorry. 00:44:01
But must still meet all local and state. 00:44:04
Food safety guidelines, regulations as well as all applicable Indiana code. 00:44:07
Joe, the only thing I'd like to add. 00:44:12
I don't know how we say it, but some or another we they need to be. 00:44:16
Understandable for the public. 00:44:20
Getting to and from the truck. 00:44:23
In other words, they don't put a truck out in the parking lot. 00:44:25
And where people are crossing lane of traffic or so. 00:44:28
They need to put some kind of safety measures, either cones. 00:44:31
Are are a designated walkway or whatever? 00:44:34
Because they're going to change the. 00:44:37
You know when they put that foot truck in? 00:44:39
It wasn't considered in the. 00:44:40
The building or the drive or all that stuff. So I don't know how you say that, but just, well, I don't think. 00:44:43
A. They would have to have the commissioners approval to make any changes to a County Road. No, I don't mean that. I don't mean 00:44:52
that or a state Rd. 00:44:56
No, I don't mean that either. I'm saying in a party, put it put. 00:45:00
Cones, you know, they don't walk across the street. 00:45:02
Yes, I'm saying if they, you know, they put up food trucks sticking them in a parking lot. 00:45:06
Take Highlander Point. 00:45:11
You know, you got the, you got the main drive through there, you put a food truck and somebody wants. 00:45:13
Somebody's going to walk out in front of a car or whatever to get to the thing. I mean, it's not a crosswalk. It's. 00:45:16
I mean we the parking lot parking lots don't have. 00:45:23
Crosswalks. I mean, I work in a building that doesn't have. So I'm just saying that it needs to be taken into consideration. 00:45:27
That's all I'm saying. I mean. 00:45:30
Give me an example. 00:45:33
Because in my head I'm thinking like, if you look like a gas station, you have been a gas station. I usually have those food 00:45:35
trucks up like. 00:45:38
No near the you know. 00:45:41
Sometimes near the gas station and. 00:45:43
You just park and then you go. I actually was down on Friday so. 00:45:46
There wouldn't necessarily need to be like a walkway or anything, as you know it's already located on a lot. Just put it. They 00:45:49
need to take into consideration safety to the. 00:45:53
Today, yeah, you gotta worry about the to the pedestrian traffic getting to and from it. 00:45:57
But to be operated unless it's fully screened to the view of the right way, one is the. 00:46:02
Like there's one in. 00:46:08
I can on Grantland Road it. 00:46:09
Right. Well, I don't. 00:46:13
You speak the unemployment office. I can't. 00:46:16
Right across from there. 00:46:18
And we've covered our **** from the standpoint from the county. We've told them to address it. 00:46:19
It's in there. 00:46:23
How they do it, it's up to them. They need to be safe. 00:46:25
I mean, I think you're trying to learn some of these things. You're asking, would you just, would you just add? 00:46:28
You know that. 00:46:33
They would have available parking. 00:46:34
For that food drug, because I think that's. 00:46:36
Kind of what you're saying. You can't. I'm just saying that in general they agree. Yeah, I just put it in someplace where nobody 00:46:38
got a place to park. They got to park on this for temporary. This is for if they're playing. 00:46:44
But they're always going to be going back to that. This is where we're having hiccups at Permanent. 00:46:51
So no, it can't stay. 00:46:59
They can't stay overnight, so the idea of putting together some language here. 00:47:01
We've had a couple. 00:47:07
Different folks come in and want to do a food truck on a baking pot. 00:47:09
And denied them those times. 00:47:13
I don't know if they even came in for the the other one but recently we denied them. 00:47:18
Kind of and the realization came that. 00:47:22
If a food truck was operating. 00:47:25
Anywhere else it went parked in a parking lot and was operating. 00:47:28
Do we want to prohibit them? 00:47:34
To to be there because. 00:47:36
The way we are looking at it is that is a separate use and we have to have a special exception for that to prevent them from being 00:47:38
vacant permanently. 00:47:42
So we were like, well, I don't think we want to prohibit food trucks in the county. 00:47:47
We just don't want them to be able to use a vacant lot. 00:47:53
As a. 00:47:57
A place of. 00:47:59
Operation because it doesn't have. 00:48:00
Necessary Parking necessary. 00:48:02
Amenities. 00:48:05
To to accommodate that. 00:48:07
So the idea was. 00:48:08
How do we put standards together? 00:48:11
That will allow food trucks to operate in a Safeway in the county. 00:48:13
Without having them. 00:48:17
Them having to get special permits, special exceptions. 00:48:19
And if it's a situation where they would need that if they come to a vacant lot, then they would have to. 00:48:23
OK, I think you just I. 00:48:28
I think I can help all of us out, so I. 00:48:30
In our definition. 00:48:33
We need more. 00:48:34
To say this is for. 00:48:35
You know. 00:48:37
Vacant lot use whatever because when I look at this. 00:48:38
And you say that we are only doing this in NC, GCHS, OB and GI. 00:48:41
We're prohibiting them from doing business at graduation parties and stuff that are on public. 00:48:45
So somewhere, no, actually this is they're within those. 00:48:50
So these are all commercial districts that these standards apply to. We have no standards for. 00:48:55
Residential district, so we could need neither. 00:49:01
So. But looking at this as a layperson, I think it reads up. 00:49:05
Oh you're telling me I can only operate my food truck in these and I can't do private rentals and go to a subdivision? 00:49:08
For a block party. 00:49:16
Or a fun or a fund. 00:49:17
Like, well, actually, yeah, you, you would not be if, if it's on someone's private residence, you could. 00:49:20
How about if it's on the on the drive, in the in the street, Yeah. 00:49:26
You could come and get a temporary use. It's not. It's not. It's on private property. 00:49:31
And yeah, it's. 00:49:36
They don't. 00:49:38
They don't have to have a permit. 00:49:38
On private property. 00:49:40
Correct. 00:49:42
Yeah, well the commercial they did, they would need a temporary use perm. 00:49:44
But you're at. 00:49:52
When we ask them. 00:49:53
The OP if they leave it overnight it has to be fully. 00:49:55
Screen from the view of the right away I've. 00:49:59
Like it's, yeah. So I think the idea of what behind that one was that. 00:50:01
So. 00:50:06
It's a not permit to a non permanent use of the site. 00:50:08
So you couldn't park it? 00:50:13
You couldn't park your truck on someone's property, or I mean. 00:50:15
On a commercial lot. 00:50:19
And just leave it there full time. Full time. 00:50:21
You couldn't leave it sit behind the JC all the time. So do we. 00:50:24
But you can leave it overnight. 00:50:28
OK, Do we? 00:50:30
Does Greenville have their own planning and. 00:50:34
We we are there planning and zoning. We contract for them because that trailer hasn't moved in two years. 00:50:36
Which one? The food truck trailer that did the old mini mall. 00:50:42
Katrina. It's like related to LA Katrina. 00:50:46
It's down there. I haven't moved. 00:50:49
They get done closed up. 00:50:51
It sits there. 00:50:53
So that would be something that we would be able to regulate. 00:50:55
Given this provision, but you're saying right now we can't right now? 00:50:59
Oh, OK, so they're not in violation for anybody listening they're but see. 00:51:03
You got to put a Max in there, don't yours. It covered someplace else, it says. 00:51:09
No night parking, less screened and less fully screened. 00:51:13
How many days can they leave it there fully screened? 00:51:17
If it's fully screened then there's no issue. It's not. 00:51:20
Then they got to take it off. That's it. 00:51:23
As a business owner, that would not be feasible. 00:51:25
Why would I want to come So the one he was just talking about his screen that could stay there. 00:51:28
Yeah. 00:51:32
But if it was screened you would. 00:51:34
It's like having it in a garage. 00:51:37
What's the definition of screen? 00:51:39
Yeah. 00:51:42
I think we were looking to just. 00:51:49
Not create the situation where a truck is parked there permanently and it kind of becomes an eyesore. I can think of one in the 00:51:55
city that's been there for. 00:52:00
Four or five years never moved and. 00:52:05
It's permanently hooked up to the building, but that's in the city. I understand that. I think one of the and I would want to get 00:52:08
to that. 00:52:11
Is we want brick and mortar? 00:52:16
Restaurants and buildings, we don't want food trucks to replace those. 00:52:18
Yes. 00:52:25
I'm with you there. 00:52:26
That that's kind of where we're coming from. 00:52:29
So if they're going to be parked there for multiple days, couldn't they just come to you for a special use like 4 day event and 00:52:31
then just for multi day use permits that? 00:52:37
Can be obtained for for special events. 00:52:43
For certain specific circumstances and those are approved at staff level. 00:52:46
Doc's Seafood. 00:52:52
Parks at the Old. 00:52:54
First Savings Bank. 00:52:56
They're there a couple days a week on Thursdays. 00:52:58
Floyd Knobs. 00:53:03
They're in Greenville on Monday, Monday. 00:53:04
So those are on commercial? 00:53:07
Properties, right? 00:53:10
Yeah, I mean, you need some place for people to stop and park and yeah. 00:53:12
That's the idea of having a. 00:53:18
Permanent structure there. That means you're going to have parking you're going to have. 00:53:19
So all I have to do is get a. 00:53:23
Temporary, they wouldn't need anything. They don't need anything meets that criteria. 00:53:25
OK, so this eliminates. 00:53:29
Well then I got. I'm understanding this better. 00:53:31
We don't want to have to do a bunch of permitting, we want people to be able to. 00:53:35
So operate. 00:53:40
You know what they're doing without. 00:53:41
Contact us and get permits all the time so so there's not a permit required to. 00:53:43
If I'm a food truck to do just the health department. 00:53:47
OK, so so. 00:53:50
The whole purpose of this is. 00:53:52
If I had a food truck and I parked it somewhere. 00:53:54
For three days. 00:53:57
But you could come out and say you're in violation. You have to move, right? 00:53:58
If it's that screen. 00:54:03
If if they leave it there overnight. 00:54:04
If they came if the dock. 00:54:06
Comes and goes every day. 00:54:08
To where they want to do business. 00:54:10
No problem. 00:54:12
Right. But if they're there. 00:54:13
I would want to leave it overnight. 00:54:16
Person actually most of these gentlemen. 00:54:18
I don't think they want to leave their stuff unattended. 00:54:23
But they got to go dump their. 00:54:29
They got to dump their wash water somewhere. 00:54:31
That's like one of the Indiana Administrative Code requirements is that they have to go to a commissary nightly. 00:54:35
They can't leave. 00:54:41
Wasted in a restaurant overnight. 00:54:42
That's the whole purpose of having. 00:54:45
Registered vehicle is the one you're done. 00:54:48
Drive it back. 00:54:51
Yeah, get rid of your crap. 00:54:53
So you want the same thing with this? 00:54:56
Yeah, before. 00:54:59
So do we have anything else to add to this? 00:55:01
So. 00:55:04
I contradicts F. 00:55:06
If we're going to say that the food trucks must not block driveways, fire lane sidewalks or accessible parking, but Oh well, it's 00:55:08
a county event, it's fine. 00:55:12
We're contradicting ourselves because we should hold ourselves up to the highest standards and making sure people have. 00:55:16
They're accessible parking and stuff like that. 00:55:22
I'm not following you. I and F contradict each other. Food truck mess. 00:55:25
I mean, I think you can already do some of those things. 00:55:32
Already. 00:55:36
In general, I just think out they. 00:55:38
What I it's not stating you can do it, it's just stating you still have to meet the local. 00:55:40
State no, it says. You're exempt from the above standards and the above standard says. 00:55:46
They oh, they must not, but you still must meet all local state. 00:55:49
Oh, that's only food. Food guidelines. 00:55:53
Yeah, so she's right. 00:55:55
There, Yeah, she is right. 00:55:57
No, it's but still beat local and state food safety guidelines and regulations as well as all applicable Indiana code. 00:56:00
So if the code is stating that you can't block. 00:56:06
So you're saying food? 00:56:09
Safety. 00:56:12
Local state foods. 00:56:13
Safety guidelines and regulations, OK. 00:56:14
As well as all the pills meaning that you don't have to. 00:56:17
Right. No, Sir, but must still. 00:56:20
Me correct. 00:56:22
But it says they're exempt from the above standards and above standard. 00:56:25
Yes, well I can just reword it to state that must still meet the standards outlined in F. 00:56:29
There you go, It's like. 00:56:34
I like that. 00:56:35
As well as. 00:56:38
All local we should be holding ourselves and our events to the highest standards possible. 00:56:39
Because we're the ones setting the examples. 00:56:44
Gotcha. 00:56:46
Good, you just combine them. 00:56:47
Huh. Could you not just combine them? 00:56:50
Both of them, I and the F. 00:56:53
So I actually I agree with you in terms of your. 00:56:55
Understanding of what it's exempting, but I disagree. I think the idea of that. 00:56:58
Item I would be for. 00:57:04
A block party or some sort of? 00:57:07
Official event where we are closing down. 00:57:10
A right away or a sidewalk and we're having. 00:57:13
Food trucks there. Something like Harvest Homecoming would be an exhibit, yes. 00:57:16
I know some fire departments have done fundraisers of that nature. 00:57:24
I think that's what that is. 00:57:29
We need to be a little bit more specific. 00:57:32
Then because I read that and feel like if I'm a lay person that we're contradicting ourselves. 00:57:35
We still have to submit a plan to Homeland Security on any event and that would cover. 00:57:41
All of that. 00:57:47
Ingress Egress. 00:57:50
All of it. 00:57:53
Has to be considered. Before you can hold an event, you have to go. 00:57:54
Come up with your operational plan. 00:57:58
And it has to be submitted to Homeland Security first. 00:58:00
But that would be for the organization and and. 00:58:08
Yeah, if it was the county or if it was. 00:58:10
You know who have to not the owner. 00:58:13
Food. Not the food, no. 00:58:16
It's I'm saying that. 00:58:18
If the county had an event or Georgetown or. 00:58:20
Whoever. 00:58:24
They have to submit a plan to Homeland Security. 00:58:25
And it would cover a lot of. 00:58:29
Those safety issues that she's referring to. 00:58:32
Sidewalks. Probably not one of them, but. 00:58:35
You still gotta have X amount of handicapped spots. 00:58:37
You still have to have. 00:58:40
You know, so many poor cans. 00:58:42
Based on what you. 00:58:45
Thank you. Population is and that type of thing. Yeah. And so again, all the data depends on the like layout. So if you're ever 00:58:46
going to pollinate, right, you see my food trucks are over on our stub. 00:58:51
Fire hydrant still accessible. 00:58:56
It's a wave, right? Parking. Like I put it somewhere. I put my cones up to keep people from driving back there. 00:58:58
But that's me as someone because I'm. 00:59:04
Continuously thinking about everyone's safety whereas someone maybe who's a new organizer. 00:59:06
No, you may not realize that at the time. 00:59:11
Their local fire and police and EMS when they make those decisions. 00:59:15
Hopefully. 00:59:19
Clean that up. 00:59:25
Again, this is at least given a guideline to. 00:59:26
People, the lay people that are owning these trucks. 00:59:30
We got to start somewhere. 00:59:34
Yeah, and I. 00:59:36
I'm familiar with the ones that you've turned down so far, and I think those are the right decisions. 00:59:38
You know, you can't just pull off side the road and. 00:59:45
Start serving fish you know. 00:59:48
Thank you. 00:59:53
Yeah, I like it. So what do we need to? 00:59:54
What's that bird? I like it. So what do we need to do? 00:59:58
Do the same thing we just did. 01:00:01
I think we'll do the same where we're each staff will request a withdrawal is we'll make notes of the suggestions. 01:00:04
We'll have those included. I'll make a motion to withdraw. 01:00:11
2nd please I do have a second on favor. 01:00:15
Aye, good work on the agenda. New business. None correct. 01:00:19
Discussion. 01:00:30
Are we done? 01:00:31
Mr. Nick. Mr. Ray. 01:00:33
I need a motion to adjourn. 01:00:35
I'll make that motion. I need a second. 01:00:36
Second, all in favor signify by thank you guys and girls. 01:00:39